Celi GT Power FC results

[monkeywrench]

While we had Troy's car in the shop for the DC header install we decided to see what the PFC could do for this combo. The car is an 03 GT with AEM intake, TRD exhaust, DC header. Two runs were done for each combination, and coolant temp was the same for every run to ensure accurate results. All repeated runs without changes were within 1whp and 1wtq. It made 135.2whp and 112.6wtq with these mods and a reset stock ECU.

After installing the PFC and some tuning the car cranked out 140.0whp and 119.5wtq. The power increase is nice, the torque increase is great and more than I expected. I was able to really smooth out and broaden the torque curve by playing the the VVT. Another benefit is the higher rev limiter, set at 7400 for the tuning session. Troy competes nationally in SCCA autoross with this car, so the higher rev limiter can give him a broader powerband to work with and allow him to avoid unnecessary upshifts at the end of the straights. Power peaks at 6600rpm, but there's still usable power above that speed. I'd guess the ideal shift speed in the 1/4 mile would be 7200-7300.

Dyno chart (http://monkeywrenchracing.com/apexi_power_fc_toyota_mr2_spyder.html)

Before you all ask, I don't know how high a stock engine can safely rev. 7400 is safe, we've revved our MR2-S well beyond that level without problems.

So, to answer everyone's questions, the PFC works great on the Celica GT. We've got the program written for Troy's car available now, I'd like to test it out (or have a customer test it) on an 00-02 car before distributing it though. Once we're satisfied with it you'll be able to get the GT PFC from us preprogrammed just like the GTS unit.

[00silverGTS6spd]

sweet!

[Illusive]

wow excellent results, thats a nice fat increase in the midrange, right where he'll need it.

:thumbup:

[Boosted2.0]

Great job MWR!! Your support for the Celica community is (as always) greatly appreciated.

The torque difference at 4000 RPM is nuts!

[cool2miketlu]

just wondering when do you expect your Datalogit back in stock?
Been waiting for it for quite awhile, got the PowerFC and commander for the GT just waiting on the datalogit now.

[afghan]

Matt was more than gracious and patient to have me looking over his shoulder all day long!:crazy2: :cool: :bang:

He wouldn't even let me get my hands dirty!

I have "total confidence" in his abilities and knowing his way around automobiles, especially Toyotas. You should see some of the Turbo installs and Projects(1zz Big Bore kit/s) they are working on and installing!

I(We) were very impressed with the DC header results. I would have been happy with 3-4 wheel hp which is all I expected. I couldn't believe how much it made!

Driving my car today(Friday) with the DC header(no PFC), I can feel it almost from the time I step on the gas in low rpms(2000-2500RPMs). The car feels and seems to breath better. It also seems to rev a little faster from low RPMs, without clutch slip.

It without a doubt, the DC Header is money well spent!

If you buy the header and aren't happy with the results, I will buy it back from you!

As far as the PFC, I have to find out if it is legal in the class I compete in (STS), which I think this is still a grey area. It probably isn't but I will find out. The whole unit is a plug and play, and will fit inside the stock ecu box.

Eithor way I can still use it for other things while not competing in SCCA events.

Matt didn't spend alot of time once the PFC was plugged in and on the dyno. He made several changes and we made several runs.

It is truly amazing what you can do with this unit in capable hands. The car was screaming for a GT after raising the rev limiter!

Any other questions, I will be happy to answer. I know I am forgetting stuff.

If you want to see and hear one of the dyno runs with header and PFC, you can email me and I will send it to you. The pull was shot before he raised the rev limiter on my car. I am a dumba**, so I couldn't figure how to link it yet!
nonpoint@chartermi.net

You can see a few pics in my gallery.:cool: :gap:

[Boosted2.0]

Yeah, the Power FC rocks - thats the power of a standalone. Just wait till one of the full standalones like the AEM finally becomes available and then you will start to see some really amazing things.

[TRD HIGH]

awesome!

[fusi0n]

thats some REALLY good news for the N/A GT owners..good job monkeywrench :bowdown:

[S|Lv3rBu||et]

Wow... thats truly an awesome improvement
Now I just have to come up with $978 :(

[VIVID GTS]

any word on this somehow working on the 03 GT-S celica????

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by VIVID GTS
any word on this somehow working on the 03 GT-S celica????

No dice untill Apexi coughs up a unit capable of controlling the electronic throttle

[celico_man]

LOL, looks like lift comes at 3500 rpm for the GT from that graph. Kool

[cool2miketlu]

Originally posted by celico_man
LOL, looks like lift comes at 3500 rpm for the GT from that graph. Kool

No lift in GT... VVT yes but no Lift :)

[cmiguel32]

That's incredible, I'm also wondering when the datalogit will be in stock, i need one pretty badly.

[Jspec]

Originally posted by celico_man
LOL, looks like lift comes at 3500 rpm for the GT from that graph. Kool

I think what he meant was if you look at the tq curve at the chart... it spikes up starting at about 3500-4000 rpm making it seem like its hitting lift.

I am very impress! I always wondered what advantages the PFC would give the GT. But I wonder if there would be any differences in the 00-02 models? Nice work monkeywrench!

Jspec

[RichGT]

So how compatible is it with f/i gt's?

[Jspec]

Originally posted by RichGT
So how compatible is it with f/i gt's?

Yes I'd also like to know. I read the another post over the FI forum about a GT turbo putting out 304whp not being able to use the PFC but the e-management. So yah will this work with a FI GT?

Jspec

[cool2miketlu]

I'll test FI part real soon
Dropping my car off to have the turbo swapped and it will go straight to the tuner :)
That is if I get the Datalogit soon...

[cmiguel32]

Originally posted by cool2miketlu
I'll test FI part real soon
Dropping my car off to have the turbo swapped and it will go straight to the tuner :)
That is if I get the Datalogit soon...


Ditto

[Vroom_Vroom]

man this is great news for the GT guys! I remember Maelfyn(whatever happened to him?) hit a14.7 or 14.8 in his GT!!! And i remember someone also posting up that they misshifted there GT (i thought it was maelfyn also) and he had a safc hooked up to it and it read 8959rpms and he said that everything was still well....

[afghan]

Yes, The PFC works even better than you think for the GT!:)

In the short time Matt spent programming, he concentrated on torque figures.

I would like to see how much HP can be had out of the GT. I thought for sure he would hit 145HP if he played with the top end some.:p: :D

[The Game]

Originally posted by afghan
I thought for sure he would hit 145HP if he played with the top end some.:p: :D
It would be a miracle if it improved the top end

[GTflava]

do you guys think that our high compression ratio has something to do with it? you know toyota somehow managed to make the 10.0:1 run on super low octane maybe the power fc removes that?

[Automaton]

Exactly. Do you think a GT could see any more gains from tuning the PFC for 91 octane?

[Asha'man]

Hey Matt,

what exactly did you tune to gain the power? Did you lean the engine out a bit? Or play with the ignition timing?

Thx for the info, man!

Thomas

[cool2miketlu]

Me mentioned he was playing with VVT.

[monkeywrench]

Originally posted by Asha'man
Hey Matt,

what exactly did you tune to gain the power? Did you lean the engine out a bit? Or play with the ignition timing?


All variables were optimized. Fuel mixture, ignition timing, VVT. Best gains are midrange where the VVT realy pays off. Top end improves nicely too.

[monkeywrench]

Originally posted by RichGT
So how compatible is it with f/i gt's?

I tried to be very clear in that other thread, but misinformation always seems to snowball on the internet.

The one turbo GT we did recently that made 305whp had something screwy with its electrical system. We didn't build the car so I don't know what it was, but we weren't able to diagnose it. It was an isolated case, something specific to that car. The emanage did an admirable job considering the boost level and custom fuel system- it's better suited to milder setups generally. A standalone has a lot of advantages that even the best piggyback can't match.

The PFC has worked great on every other 1ZZ we've used it on, turbo or not. You saw the torque gains on an NA engine- they're MUCH bigger on a turbo car because the stock ECU's VVT map isn't anywhere near optimized for turbo. Add to that the ability to up the rev limiter and get perfect driveability and the PFC would be my choice for a turbo Celi.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by monkeywrench
I tried to be very clear in that other thread, but misinformation always seems to snowball on the internet.

The one turbo GT we did recently that made 305whp had something screwy with its electrical system. We didn't build the car so I don't know what it was, but we weren't able to diagnose it. It was an isolated case, something specific to that car. The emanage did an admirable job considering the boost level and custom fuel system- it's better suited to milder setups generally. A standalone has a lot of advantages that even the best piggyback can't match.

The PFC has worked great on every other 1ZZ we've used it on, turbo or not. You saw the torque gains on an NA engine- they're MUCH bigger on a turbo car because the stock ECU's VVT map isn't anywhere near optimized for turbo. Add to that the ability to up the rev limiter and get perfect driveability and the PFC would be my choice for a turbo Celi.

Well said, I couldn't agree more! The power gains we were seeing on Smaays car once he started changing the VVTi mapping were huge!

[spidalegz_2002]

Originally posted by monkeywrench
All variables were optimized. Fuel mixture, ignition timing, VVT. Best gains are midrange where the VVT realy pays off. Top end improves nicely too.

hmm I autocross regionally here in AZ and was wondering if you could try the power fc on a auto gt. remember, we all dont have manuals :(

[Smaay]

Good job tuning Matt

[silvercelica2000]

whp meaning on engine flywheel or car wheel? Sorry but i need to clarify these as I am making 210hp on the engine flywheel and on the car wheel is about 175hp.

[spidalegz_2002]

whp = wheel horse power

[GTflava]

yeah so that gt is making 140whp so that means its about 165hp to the crank. 15 hp away from the gts

[spidalegz_2002]

what about the automatics?!?!? :cry:

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by spidalegz_2002
what about the automatics?!?!? :cry:

I may be wrong, but I have heard that the Power FC is not designed to control automatic transmissions so it is not reccomended for use with them.

[spidalegz_2002]

shiza. anyone hear anything different??? im bout to sell my car

[Fourgig]

Originally posted by afghan
As far as the PFC, I have to find out if it is legal in the class I compete in (STS), which I think this is still a grey area. It probably isn't but I will find out.

Piggybacks are legal in STS, but full ECU replacements are not. If the PFC was legal, all the Celica's in the San Francisco region would be running it already. :)

[maddogcde]

where's marc at...I can't believe he hasn't weighed in yet

[spidalegz_2002]

damn. well im already in SM so i dont think i would be put into any other class already.

[The Game]

Originally posted by spidalegz_2002
shiza. anyone hear anything different??? im bout to sell my car

sell it

[00silverGTS6spd]

Originally posted by The Game
sell it
:werd:

6spd > you

[spidalegz_2002]

true. or 6spd swap?

[X-EVIL-X]

Originally posted by GTflava
yeah so that gt is making 140whp so that means its about 165hp to the crank. 15 hp away from the gts
not really
i made 174 to the wheels vs the 140 of yours. still off by the same if the gts is modded.

[igotan02=/]

Originally posted by spidalegz_2002
true. or 6spd swap?


Jersay jay put down 240 whp with his turbo auto gts. But i dont know if u want to turbo your car.

[spidalegz_2002]

Originally posted by igotan02=/
Jersay jay put down 240 whp with his turbo auto gts. But i dont know if u want to turbo your car.

well, i cannot figure what would work best with the tranny. either way it WILL go out. if i go auto, i would do ANY F/I besides n20

[larryd]

Originally posted by Boosted2.0
Great job MWR!! Your support for the Celica community is (as always) greatly appreciated.

The torque difference at 4000 RPM is nuts!

:werd:

[Joe Schmoe]

What octane fuel was used during testing??

[afghan]

I put 6 gallons of 92 octane, since I was almost out of gas before arriving at Matts shop.

Matt said it doesn't matter since he can dial the car to run 87 octane with same results.:cool:

[Joe Schmoe]

Originally posted by afghan

Matt said it doesn't matter since he can dial the car to run 87 octane with same results.:cool:
If that's the case, why not tune it for 91 and let everyone reap the gains??

[Asha'man]

@Matt: Really great work! Maybe I will get a PFC sometime from you, just to have it compared to my emanage. If the gain and possibilties are great I will keep it and sell the emanage...if not...it's just the other way round.

Did you enrich the fuelmixture or lean it out? I thought the stock setup is very lean to apply to emission regulations. That's what it is about here in germany. But I think your emission laws are not as strict as they are here in germany.

[party2go]

:drool: i want.......I WANT.............i can't afford it either :wtc: :furious:

[GTflava]

Originally posted by X-EVIL-X
not really
i made 174 to the wheels vs the 140 of yours. still off by the same if the gts is modded. hey man good to hear from ya! havent seen you much on bb.com maybe im just not looking. but what do you have that lets you get 174whp?

[GTflava]

Originally posted by X-EVIL-X
not really
i made 174 to the wheels vs the 140 of yours. still off by the same if the gts is modded. hey man good to hear from ya! havent seen you much on bb.com maybe im just not looking. but what do you have that lets you get 174whp?