Anyone tried AEM/EMS on 1ZZ/2ZZ

[turboceli2003]

Theres a local shop that thinks they can get an AEM/EMS to work on my celica. They will bye it, and try to tune it,, if they can get it to work, i just buy it off of them.. if they dont get it to work they will keep it for one of their other cars.. I was wondering if anyone has already attempted this. Thanks.

[Boosted2.0]

TRD / Toyota Motorsports has one running on a turbo matrix pacecar - thats the only one i have heard of.

[cool2miketlu]

Man... gonna be so hard to figure out which wire to use and gets to go where... Good luck please take lots of notes so people who is interested later on can wire one in as well :)

[NoRulzAt140 Mph]

what is this..?

[cool2miketlu]

AEM EMS is a standalone which is superior to PowerFC. However since they do not make application specifically for Celica you have to buy a generic one and figure out which wires to use and where to connect it to. Also there is no base map so you will have to make a map from scratch. It is not an easy task, but if done right it can control EVERY aspect of your engine management.

[NoRulzAt140 Mph]

Originally posted by cool2miketlu
AEM EMS is a standalone which is superior to PowerFC. However since they do not make application specifically for Celica you have to buy a generic one and figure out which wires to use and where to connect it to. Also there is no base map so you will have to make a map from scratch. It is not an easy task, but if done right it can control EVERY aspect of your engine management.

what does it run?

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by NoRulzAt140 Mph
what does it run?

do you mean how expensive is it or what components can it control?

[turboceli2003]

what does it run?
I think they are around 1400-2200

i thought they made a "universal" one but i dont think that they do... I think that i am going to use the one from a 1st-2nd gen eclipse... not that it really matters cuz if im starting with a blank map it should all be the same execpt for the wiring....

[cool2miketlu]

Just make sure you are not the person to pay for all the hours they spent figuring wiring out, that is a huge task! Generic = universal type which comes with bunch of wires which alot of them you will not use, also the dyno time to get a map in there....
I wish you luck on the project, it is not a small project and it will take awhile to get right.

[NoRulzAt140 Mph]

Originally posted by Boosted2.0
do you mean how expensive is it or what components can it control?

Price :)

[Smaay]

the AEM EMS runs about 1500-1700 bucks...yes its expensive but well worth the money. combined with a wideband O2 it does all the dataloging you could ever need. and then you can tune the car on the street. no need for a dyno (except to tell when you are making more or less power) I have one in my MR2 and Boosted has one in his All-Trac....luckily we can share MAP's cause we have close to the same setups...therefore we have learned alot from eachother on tuning issues...Well i learned more from him...Who loves ya Boosted :) anyways, it has 100X the tuning ability of the Power FC....Worth every penny to me...

[CIN]

Yes but a PFC is more than enough to tune your engine right if you have the datalogit.

I say go for the PFC considering that there is no specific application for the 2ZZ. It is not like the PFC is not capable of running the engine. Heck it is used even on high powerd R34s/EVOs/Impreza's and people seem to be rather satisfied with what you get.

[cool2miketlu]

Yeah PFC is more than enough for Celica, AEM is not really needed. It would be a nice option though :) Peps who get the tranny gear from c2power and thinking about running high boost may want to consider this option.

[Boosted2.0]

The AEM (or something like it) will become necessary when people start thinking about 10s and 11s in the Celica. Things like the 2 step and the ability to run upgraded ignition and speed density will be quite helpful at that point.

oh another cool thing about the AEM is it can control auto trannies too, something Apexi hasn't figured out yet.

[CIN]

Yeah seems that the AEM is a nice little box of magic. Most people will never reach 11s though. An 11s celica is basically a drag only car.

For those that want a circuit car a Power FC is more than enough IMO. The AEM would be a nice option if it came prepared for the 2ZZ though. The auto tune feature is very nice and could save you some headaches until you can go on a dyno to tune. :)

BTW Boosted did you find out how to use the MAP sensor on the 2ZZ Power FC? I think Simon(celica UK) has sucessfully made the swap and it seems that he figured out how to make it work rather nicely.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by CIN
Yeah seems that the AEM is a nice little box of magic. Most people will never reach 11s though. An 11s celica is basically a drag only car.

For those that want a circuit car a Power FC is more than enough IMO. The AEM would be a nice option if it came prepared for the 2ZZ though. The auto tune feature is very nice and could save you some headaches until you can go on a dyno to tune. :)

BTW Boosted did you find out how to use the MAP sensor on the 2ZZ Power FC? I think Simon(celica UK) has sucessfully made the swap and it seems that he figured out how to make it work rather nicely.

Most owners of ANY type of car never reach 11s.

Anyways we havent been able to try it yet - been waiting for 00silverGTS to buy a MAP sensor so we can get started. All the sensors I have for my car are designed for Turbo, not NA so the voltage scaling is way off.

I also have a slight concern about temps affecting this since the Power FC is not designed to make a intake temp based speed density conversion, but we're going to try it and see how well it works.

[cool2miketlu]

Hmmm it is always something...
AEM EMS can't get the AC working thus the delay (rumors) :(
PFC can't control auto tranny :(

[CIN]

Originally posted by Boosted2.0
Most owners of ANY type of car never reach 11s.

Anyways we havent been able to try it yet - been waiting for 00silverGTS to buy a MAP sensor so we can get started. All the sensors I have for my car are designed for Turbo, not NA so the voltage scaling is way off.

I also have a slight concern about temps affecting this since the Power FC is not designed to make a intake temp based speed density conversion, but we're going to try it and see how well it works.

Do you have acess to the datalogit forums? There is some very nice info there.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by CIN
Do you have acess to the datalogit forums? There is some very nice info there.

Nope - didn't even know there were datalogit forums.

[CIN]

Do you have a datalogit? If you or one of your friends has you can register the datalogit and take part. It is more of a mailing list but you can find the past entries in the yahoo group. There are very knowledgeable people that take part in discussions and I think you will find some nice info on the MAP matter.

If you want I can try and help you with the Map change by supplying some info I gathered.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by CIN
Do you have a datalogit? If you or one of your friends has you can register the datalogit and take part. It is more of a mailing list but you can find the past entries in the yahoo group. There are very knowledgeable people that take part in discussions and I think you will find some nice info on the MAP matter.

If you want I can try and help you with the Map change by supplying some info I gathered.

I understand the wiring and the principle of the swap and the wiring, but any information you have on any special settings or modifications that were made to the power FC software would be great.

[cool2miketlu]

Boosted you can borrow my id (since you are tuning for me and I hardly use it) I just have to remember the link to the forums :chuckles:
I have to go home and check my computer :)

[Boosted2.0]

Cool - thanks Mike!

[Smaay]

Boosted, what Simon did was still used the MAF for AIT...

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by Smaay
Boosted, what Simon did was still used the MAF for AIT...

I know - but there is a big difference between the way a speed density MAP system uses IAT and how a MAF based feed forward system does.

[cool2miketlu]

Smaay do you have the login page link to the datalogit forum? I lost my link, I can guess my id and password if you are able to give me that link then let Boosted 2.0 use it. Thanks.

[Boosted2.0]

been looking over the datalogit forum - it does not appear that the map swap is using any air temp correction. The downside of this is that they car will perform poorly at different temps - the A/F ratios will get leaner as the temps get cooler. As such it may be necessary to make a couple maps for the car - one for each increment of 20-30 degrees or so.

[cool2miketlu]

ehhh... so So Cal you need 3 settings... 1 for Santa Ana winds condtion for about a week, 1 for cold winter weeks :chuckles: , and 1 for normal So Cal weather :gap:

[CIN]

Boosted sorry for not replying earlier but I had my PC under repair. Seems you found your way in the forums though.

As for the Map swap i think Simon was still looking for a way to input the IAT. Might be a good idea to talk to him. ;)

[Boosted2.0]

You would need to do more than just input it, the Power FC would have to have the speed density conversion tables to make having the temp signal be worthwhile.

[CIN]

Yep. Simon seem to be doing fine with what he did though.

One more thing. I was looking at my PFC japan manual and there is pressure sensor part number on it which should be compatible with the 2ZZ power FC.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by CIN
Yep. Simon seem to be doing fine with what he did though.

One more thing. I was looking at my PFC japan manual and there is pressure sensor part number on it which should be compatible with the 2ZZ power FC.

Hmm - so maybe they do have it set up for speed density after all as an option. Defnitely worth exploring.

[seaspyder]

I've looked into an AEM for my turboed 2000 Spyder (1zz). I actually bought a used AEM EMS for a Honda application and made a conversion harness. I could never get the timing to sync. The problem seems to be that the 1zz has a fairly uniqe triggering setup and I think to make it work would require a crank-mounted trigger wheel.

You will find that AEM offers no support for installs on anything other than their supported applications.

I would have kept messing with it but it was starting to take up too much of my time. I sold it for about what I paid and bought a PFC.

[turboceli2003]

cool, thanks for the info..

[Nu Concept]

there is a 1zz celica test subject being experimented on with the AEM unit right now....

[Boosted2.0]

Originally posted by Nu Concept
there is a 1zz celica test subject being experimented on with the AEM unit right now....

Prove it.

AEM's head of EMS development and one of their top tuners both say they still haven't cracked the serial data stream (at least as of like 3 weeks ago).

[Nu Concept]

Originally posted by Boosted2.0
Prove it.


e-mail technacelica@yahoo.com.
he is my proof.