TRD Supercharger for 1zz NOT likely

[Keyshawn]

Got this email from TRD recently:

thank you for your interest in TRD.
We are working on an intake system, springs and exhaust for the Matrix.
The 1zz (VVt) engine is still under review for a supercharger; however not
likely.
Thank you!
TRD Help

[HisFrogness]

So you specifically asked about the 1zz, but not the 2zz?
............................. :'(

[Keyshawn]

Originally posted by HisFrogness
So you specifically asked about the 1zz, but not the 2zz?
............................. :'(

Actually, I didn't even ask about the Matrix or the 1zz at all. They just sent me some standard email that they send to anyone, regardless of what their question is.

[coOOlcelica]

trd is gay

:gay:

[NSX_GTR_LM]

Originally posted by coOOlcelica
trd is gay

:gay:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[BoyRacer]

no offence man. but you asking a million people about this turbo kit, and superchrger kit for the gt and the gt-s and the results form different company's is confusing people. some companys say yes, some say no, some say different answer to different people. i think its good that you are doing some ivestigative reporting.......but....ya know. how bout we just wait till we have something solid.

[Keyshawn]

BoyRacer,
I see where you're coming from, but I'd rather share what these companies tell me directly than read totally inaccurate rumors that come out of nowhere. There's always gonna be TONS of rumors and speculation on a site like this, regardless of whether I post a single word or not. My info is usually pretty accurate, though. Thanks for the honest opinion, man.

[David Draper]

Well, I'm stickin' with the answer I got from the Senior Development Technician:

1ZZ supercharger is a 99% go. The one that GM was referring to with the release of the Vibe is being co-developed by TRD and GM.

This is why when that one guy called Eaton (I forgot who and which post--I know, really helpful) about doing a supercharger for the 1ZZ they declined, citing the fact that they were already under contract with TRD with regard supercharging that engine.

What I wasn't impressed by was the incredibly low output-about 180 hp at the crank!

With TRD asking for somewhere in the $3000 - $3500 range, +
install, you're looking at close to $100 per hp. That's kinda weak I think....

[Keyshawn]

Gee, thanks David, right when I say that my info is usually accurate, you go and mess me up like that!j/k Hehe. Anyway, your info about the 1zz s/c is probably more accurate because you know some of the bigwigs there. However, I still think that MOST of my info is usually accurate.;)

[David Draper]

Originally posted by Keyshawn
Gee, thanks David, right when I say that my info is usually accurate, you go and mess me up like that!j/k Hehe. Anyway, your info about the 1zz s/c is probably more accurate because you know some of the bigwigs there. However, I still think that MOST of my info is usually accurate.;)

Hey, sorry, I've just known about that for quite some time, so I thought I'd post it.

The information you give is usually relayed right on the money, but the people at TRD tend to give you completely different stories depending on who you talk to.

[BoyRacer]

im glad we are all still on good terms.....:). i would like to see a worth while mod for my car as much as the next guy......i just bought the last two things essentially i can do to my motor (NA).....i am ready to step up to the S/c....this way i didnt piss my money away for the header i just got. lol. does anyone know how much a small eaton s/c would run? i member larry saying he tired every which way to shove one under his hood with no luck.....something small but not to small would be great.....thanks.

[larryd]

hehe.. not likely.. they might as well toss into the email "but we offer nice shirts" :)

[YoGi BeAr]

180 at the crank~!! $100 per hp~!!!....damn...thas sad and depressing to hear... it would of been cheaper if i bought a GTS~ anyhow.... hows the turbo coming if i don't mind asking?

[Sublime]

Don't forget that this is a positive displacement SC, so the torque will probably jump to at least 180ft-lbs and the HP curve won't be nearly as peaky as a 2zz. It'll feel more like a V6 then an I4. Considering the price difference between the GT and GT-S is about $3500 (same as the SC kit) I think I'd take a factory SC'd GT over a GT-S.

[larryd]

the thing about the 180crank hp is it could be changed just by changing the pulley on the s/c to run more boost.. I can only thing they must be thinking like 4lbs or something to only attain a 40crank hp difference..

[t2000gts]

Originally posted by larryd
the thing about the 180crank hp is it could be changed just by changing the pulley on the s/c to run more boost.. I can only thing they must be thinking like 4lbs or something to only attain a 40crank hp difference..

exactly. the camry/tacoma guys do this, put different pulleys on for more boost.

[atehrani]

Originally posted by David Draper
...What I wasn't impressed by was the incredibly low output-about 180 hp at the crank!...

That doesn't sound right. Looking at it from a marketing stand-point, why have the GT-S line then (2ZZ-GE)? If the 1ZZ-FE can make the same HP and have more torque in a more usuable power-band.

Toyota's in kind of a bind here, the 1ZZ-FE was made in house, so they can do whatever they want to that motor. However, the more they build that, the more they encroch upon the 2ZZ-GE. But, the 2ZZ-GE was developed by Yahmaha, and I'm assuming they have a contract with them to produce that motor for x amount of years and without any modifications (unless for saftey and such). So they really can't touch it, at least that is my opinion on the matter.

[Sublime]

Originally posted by larryd
the thing about the 180crank hp is it could be changed just by changing the pulley on the s/c to run more boost.. I can only thing they must be thinking like 4lbs or something to only attain a 40crank hp difference..

40 crank hp makes sense to me... thats almost a 40% boost. TRD uses eaton roots SC. While they're great bang for the buck and bullet-proof reliable, they don't do to well on the top end. They'll produce tons of torque, but when you push them to produce over say 8lbs of boost, they're not happy and the effeicency drops off quick.
To get the 1zz to produce 180hp without an IC (because TRD are a bunch of cheap bastards :) ) is not as easy as you'd think. Here's the math:
SHP * PR * CD * AE * DE = Final HP
SHP = Stock HP = 130hp
PR = Pressure ratio (boost + 14.7)/14.7... so lets say they run 8psi, which is duable non IC'd if they dump extra fuel in to cool the charge. That means PR = 1.55
CD = Charge density, for non-IC'd lets say about 85%, so .85
AE = Adiabatic effiency. this is the pumping effeicency of the SC divided by the pumping effeicency of the engine. Its how much the SC helps the engine breath. In our case its pretty close to 1 because the roots isn't a very good breather for an SC and a DOHC is pretty good for an engine, but we'll call it 1.1 to be nice.
DE = Drive effecency, SCs suck up HP to run. Lets be nice and call it .98

130*1.55*.85*1.1*.98=185hp

And that was being leinent is some areas. Starting with only 130hp its hard to make a lot of power.

[t2000gts]

the 2ZZ-GE belongs purely to Toyota even if Yamaha did design the head for them. they didn't build it for them. they can do whatever they want to the 2ZZ. it's just that it's hard to mod cheaply.

[Keyshawn]

Originally posted by t2000gts
the 2ZZ-GE belongs purely to Toyota even if Yamaha did design the head for them. they didn't build it for them. they can do whatever they want to the 2ZZ. it's just that it's hard to mod cheaply.

11.5 compression, a returnless fuel system, and the perception that the 2zz is not nearly as stout as the RSX's K20 engine are some big reasons why VERY FEW companies are attempting forced induction for the 2zz.

[Sublime]

Originally posted by Keyshawn


11.5 compression, a returnless fuel system, and the perception that the 2zz is not nearly as stout as the RSX's K20 engine are some big reasons why VERY FEW companies are attempting forced induction for the 2zz.

Thick copper gasket, larger injectors (or software), 1 example to correct the persception... whats taking so long? :)