Amp Overheating

[tagyoreit]

Currently running 2 sony xplode amps, one for interiors, one for sub. I notice on hot days when my car sitrs for a while and I play music afterwards the sub amp turnes to protective mode (red light) and shuts off after about 20 minutes. This doesn't happen on cool days and this is something relatively new. I believe the temp is way too hot in the trunk with no where to vent and things just begin shutting down. Any recommendations besides installing amp fans in the trunk vented towards the cabin. (pretty ugly).


Current setup:
http://teamcelica.com/members/3/CarbonBlueGTSceli31.jpg

Any help would be appreciated.

George

[ragingpaseo]

sony xplode series tends to do that, it will going into protection mode a lot... i have an es 5 channel in the paseo, it does that a lot...maybe you're sending too much signal...

[tagyoreit]

I just purchased two fans i am going to work into my setup somehow and i turned everything down on the amp and up on the headunit. Maybe that will do the trick. Now instead of playing my tunes at a volume 50 i can leave it at about 38 and it's perfect. Thankfully there is alot of EQ settings on my Pioneer HU and isolated sub control.

[2way]

Heatsink them to something metal... add cooling fans......

[ragingpaseo]

^isn't that what he said? LOL...

[SickCelica696]

why the hell is your volume at 50? can you even hear if the bass cuts out? maybe thats your hearing not the amps...

[RATIFIED]

Gains set too high, poor grounds or not enough current can cause amps to overheat. I have used some of the older Sony ES ( the large red ones that have the same sink design of the PG M series) and have never had one go into protection mode.

[tagyoreit]

I'll recheck the grounds too, good idea. Good point with the volume 50. For some reason I couldn't get the settings correct on the head unit and I finally figured out that there is a mid level EQ that brought the volume up as a whole. I had it on low since I installed it. That would explain that. I noticed yesterday the amp cut out again even with all of the new settings. Still waiting for the fans, maybe that will help. I really think it has alot to do with the setup and the amps being mounted so close to the plastic trunk cover when the hatch is closed... poor ventilation.

As you can see:
http://teamcelica.com/members/3/CarbonBlueGTSceli31.jpg

[ragingpaseo]

Gains set too high, poor grounds or not enough current can cause amps to overheat. I have used some of the older Sony ES ( the large red ones that have the same sink design of the PG M series) and have never had one go into protection mode.
i have one generation before the current es amp, ground is located at the seatbelt assembly, can't get anymore metal then there. gain is set at helf way. and current is drain for a 1F capacitor. however, protection mode still pop up here and there...

[tagyoreit]

I too am using the seatbelt bolt which has been sanded to the metal. I agree about the ground, can't get much better than that.

[RATIFIED]

Yes, but size is the wire?? I never use anything smaller than 4ga for any decnet size amp. Also, the gain should be matched to the headunit. Gain is not a volume control. There are several ways to do this; everything from the 3/4 volume way ( 99% of all headunit start to distort after this) to using an osciliscope (*sp). I personally leave my gains all the way down, but my headunit has 8v preouts. I could squeeze more by setting this slightly up, but I prefer the extra headroom.

Some amps just run hot and are real picky about air flow.

[ragingpaseo]

sony es using 30A fuse for the amp. wiring is 8G with 40 amp fuse. i say that's good enough...

[RATIFIED]

What headunit are you using?? Trying dropping the gains down slightly and seeif that helps.

[ragingpaseo]

kenwood excelon x817, gain is half way, and excelon's EQ is doing all the filtering...

[RATIFIED]

Nice deck. I'm a big fan of the excelon line, but went Pioneer Premier for the XM. With 4.5v preouts, half way may be a tad too much. Try cutting it down slightly, say 1/4 -3/8. Basically what happens is that at high volumes the amp is overdriven, causing it to begin clipping; which increases the heat till the protection circuit kicks in.

[2way]

^isn't that what he said? LOL...
Not quite... adding heatsinking or attaching to metal for heatsinking would have helped as an option to the fans, which was part of his original question.

As for the fans... I reaffirmed his decision to add them. He could also use temp sensor fans that only kick on & off @ a certain temps or vary their speed depending on temp.

If it only happened in hot temps... it was unlikely to be an overdrive problem, which would occur @ any temp... but more frequently in higher temps.

[tagyoreit]

Not quite... adding heatsinking or attaching to metal for heatsinking would have helped as an option to the fans, which was part of his original question.

As for the fans... I reaffirmed his decision to add them. He could also use temp sensor fans that only kick on & off @ a certain temps or vary their speed depending on temp.

If it only happened in hot temps... it was unlikely to be an overdrive problem, which would occur @ any temp... but more frequently in higher temps.


I agree completely... any wiring issues would make themselves present at any tempurature. Therefore, the temperature is the real issue. I did a test today and pulled the plastic trunk cover off and did my usual drive home in 85 degree heat windows down. Usually only last 20 minutes before my sub amp cuts but today, no problems at all. I think fans will do the trick. I'll know in a week. I am mounting two facing the cabin at the amps.

[2way]

Either use both as exhausts out... or mount one high facing out and one low facing in... on an opposing side to create an airflow, like a PC case (remember heat rises).

[ragingpaseo]

Nice deck. I'm a big fan of the excelon line...
actually, that's the paseo's setup, celica gets better treatment of excelon x879, infinity 5761a 6 channel amp... :chuckles:

[ragingpaseo]

I agree completely... any wiring issues would make themselves present at any tempurature. Therefore, the temperature is the real issue. I did a test today and pulled the plastic trunk cover off and did my usual drive home in 85 degree heat windows down. Usually only last 20 minutes before my sub amp cuts but today, no problems at all. I think fans will do the trick. I'll know in a week. I am mounting two facing the cabin at the amps.
where is your amp mounted again? on the trunk floor? back of the rear seats? plastic side panel???

[NeverGod]

liquid cool your amp :)

[tagyoreit]

There is a link on the first post of my setup. ^

[ragingpaseo]

^hum..maybe put a 3/16 plexiglass underneath???

[tagyoreit]

Think that would do anything? Since heat rises wouldn't you expect the amp to be venting from the back - up instead of the bottom? That's why you are supposed to mount amps flat and not on a 90 degree angle so you don't cook it in its own juicy heat.... :p

[ragingpaseo]

i use to have an amp laying flat on the trunk floor...it soaked up a lot of heat underneath...

[RATIFIED]

Still say, try turning down the gains. Gains are not volume controls and are designed to match one amp to another one; even if the same brand. You take off the cover and they stay on. More air flow, the cooler the amp will run; no matter where it is. Just try turning down the gains and see if it helps. Much easier to do than anything else listed here. I've seen more problems caused by improper gain settings than almost anything else, with bad/poor ground being #1.

[2way]

Of course, turning down the gains will help... the amp won't be working as hard.... won't be generating as much heat... drawing as much current...etc.

However, that's treating the symptom & not the cause. If there is a confined space... holding heat.... more than likely... it will still have an overheat problem... it will just take longer.

[SingleCamCivic]

"I believe the temp is way too hot in the trunk with no where to vent and things just begin shutting down."

Put your back seats down to let some fresh air in there, crank the AC and let if flow into the back. A couple fans may help. Amps create a lot of heat and if youre over 100+ before you even start the music, its going to get to the protect limit quickly. I have this issue with just about every amp I've had in phoenix if you leave the car out in the sun for any period of time during the summer. During the winter, I can run my amps all day long with no issues.

[tagyoreit]

"I believe the temp is way too hot in the trunk with no where to vent and things just begin shutting down."

Put your back seats down to let some fresh air in there, crank the AC and let if flow into the back. A couple fans may help. Amps create a lot of heat and if youre over 100+ before you even start the music, its going to get to the protect limit quickly. I have this issue with just about every amp I've had in phoenix if you leave the car out in the sun for any period of time during the summer. During the winter, I can run my amps all day long with no issues.

That is what I have been doing lately but it only helps sometimes. Because the heat is rising and there is not much room (maybe 1-2 inches) for it to escape into the cabin, it tends to move very slowly if at all that direction.

[SickCelica696]

remove the cargo cover, that worked for me, then the trunk isnt a closed hot box. If your worried about theft, I kept mine hinged so i could just slie it back over the subs when I parked the car.

[tagyoreit]

remove the cargo cover, that worked for me, then the trunk isnt a closed hot box. If your worried about theft, I kept mine hinged so i could just slie it back over the subs when I parked the car.

That is the best solution yes... it's just another pain in the ass because I hate when people know what I have in my car. Knowing me i would always forget to put it back on... :p

[2way]

Drill holes in it

[tagyoreit]

I was thinking about putting some nice rivits in it or something like that but it's so permanate... maybe a grill...

[SickCelica696]

i havent put mine back on in bout 3 monthes and i work near baltimore, my subs are here, no alarm system either...its all about luck i guess

[tagyoreit]

I just got the fans... now what's the best way to wire these. They both have 3 wires... red/black/white. I assume cut the connectors off, black to ground, red to hot, white???? to what.... you think in-line fuze and pull power from the remote turn on lead? Is a relay required? What are your thoughts...

[RATIFIED]

White is most likely rpms. I would use a relay or Stinger makes a nice thermostat to control fans. You could take off the bottom plate and have the fans blow in through the bottom. Cuts down on fan noise and hides them. Just space the amp up off of the floor with some short 1/2" spacers.

[tagyoreit]

That's a great idea from the bottom. Do you think a 1/2 inch is enough clearance to push that air out? And is that more efficient then mounting them from above? I would think so...

[tagyoreit]

Anybody have a link to that stinger thermostat? or an equivalent? May be a cool idea... what's a good temp for that bad boy to kick on?

[RATIFIED]

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We have done a few installs like this and have had good results. If 1/2 inch isn't enough, add another spacer and try it. Basically, you are pressurizing the inside of the amp (very slightly) which forces air out