"No can Smoke" 16NOV06

[RUSH]

:furious: Sorry I'm a smoker, and I must say I hope hawaii tourist goes down 50% from this retarded move, and state is forced to take it back. I mean non-smokers have a right not to be around smokers, but smokers have a right to smoke. its like the whole toilet argue between the sexs. they need it down well we need it up.
And for all those beeeoches bitchen about where I work blah blah blah . why can they find a job that don't allow smoking? cause their losers. its like listening to a garbage man complaining about why they got take out the trash. If I don't like something about my job I get another which doesn't envolve that certain something.
So what next thing is no alchohol in bars? cause its cause alchoholics to drink?

Just wanted to vent..

[BuLLy-K]

Well, I quit in April or May. I think that the rule is absolutist and totalitarian. The arguments both for and against the law can be found in the Preamble:

We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal, that they are endowed, by their Creator, with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the Consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles, and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

Prudence indeed, will dictate, that Governments long established, should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.


My stance on this? Here is what happens when politicians get together in our political arena to try and please the powers that be.
Some fine examples of this are:

The Rail Transit System study
Reasons why it took sooo long to get power back in some places after the earthquake
The Speed Strips in Nuuanu that had to be removed
The Traffic Camera Vans (Hahaha, remember that fiasco?)


Now look at this problem from a National view. It is only through process that things like this will be resolved. It is because we live in America that we have this opportunity. But still, it is strange how we have had to suffer as a nation ever since Bush took office. How many times have we heard him spout off about the number of troops in Iraq & Afghanistan (He says almost nothing about how the casualties). Notice how the gas prices skyrocketed and then suddenly stabilized right before election time? So, when will the troops come home? I support them... but not the decision to keep them there. Just another example of Bush's tactics and how his supporters will watch their own backs, not ours.

So, sit back and watch. This no smoking law was discussed months ago and it passed. Where was everyone then? There are tens of thousands of smokers in every city here. Where was everyone? The law was given a back seat to the rise in gas prices and anything else that could make the front page of the morning paper.

[BuLLy-K]

Here is some trivia to show the price of freedom. Some is true some maybe exagerations or false. But chew-mental on this while you eat your turkey this year.
(http://www.snopes.com/history/american/pricepaid.asp)

Have you ever wondered what happened to the 56 men who signed the Declaration of Independence?

Five signers were captured by the British as traitors and tortured before they died.

Twelve had their homes ransacked and burned.

Two lost their sons serving in the Revolutionary Army, another had two sons captured.

Nine of the 56 fought and died from wounds or hardships of the Revolutionary War.

They signed and they pledged their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor.

What kind of men were they?

Twenty-four were lawyers and jurists. Eleven were merchants, nine were farmers and large plantation owners; men of means, well educated. But they signed the Declaration of Independence knowing full well that the penalty would be death if they were captured.

Carter Braxton of Virginia, a wealthy planter and trader, saw his ships swept from the seas by the British Navy. He sold his home and properties to pay his debts, and died in rags.

Thomas McKeam was so hounded by the British that he was forced to move his family almost constantly. He served in the Congress without pay, and his family was kept in hiding. His possessions were taken from him, and poverty was his reward.

Vandals or soldiers looted the properties of Dillery, Hall, Clymer, Walton, Gwinnett, Heyward, Ruttledge, and Middleton.

At the battle of Yorktown, Thomas Nelson, Jr., noted that the British General Cornwallis had taken over the Nelson home for his headquarters. He quietly urged General George Washington to open fire. The home was destroyed, and Nelson died bankrupt.

Francis Lewis had his home and properties destroyed. The enemy jailed his wife, and she died within a few months.

John Hart was driven from his wife's bedside as she was dying. Their 13 children fled for their lives. His fields and his gristmill were laid to waste. For more than a year, he lived in forests and caves, returning home to find his wife dead and his children vanished. A few weeks later, he died from exhaustion and a broken heart.

Norris and Livingston suffered similar fates.

Such were the stories and sacrifices of the American Revolution. These were not wild-eyed, rabble-rousing ruffians. They were soft-spoken men of means and education. They had security, but they valued liberty more.

Standing talk straight, and unwavering, they pledged: "For the support of this declaration, with firm reliance on the protection of the divine providence, we mutually pledge to each other, our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor."

They gave you and me a free and independent America. The history books never told you a lot about what happened in the Revolutionary War. We didn't fight just the British. We were British subjects at that time and we fought our own government!

Some of us take these liberties so much for granted, but we shouldn't.

So, take a few minutes while enjoying your 4th of July Holiday and silently thank these patriots. It's not much to ask for the price they paid. Remember: Freedom is never free!

I hope you will show your support by please sending this to as many people as you can. It's time we get the word out that patriotism is NOT a sin, and the Fourth of July has more to it than beer, picnics, and baseball games.

[pam.cakez]

i am glad that they passed that law. i hate the smell of smoke........ and it's irritating! some people don't even have any consideration that you're standing right there and they're blowing the smoke right in front of you. i don't want lung cancer! that's why i never did pick up a ciggarette in my life.

sorry gary....i don't know how this law can be compared to as totalitarian. when i think of totalitarian.....i think about stalin or hitler.............. they made people suffer... i'm pretty sure no one will suffer like that without smoking... i mean they could just walk 20 feet away and smoke... no biggie

[slopokegts]

i think the law was approved and passed mainly because of the fact of how second hand smoke affects others. who knows...maybe this will help people to stop smoking? i agree with rush though about how the tourism industry might get affected by it. and i agree with pam about they can move away. it's not like it's illegal to smoke at all. they just have to move away from those that don't wish to smoke. it's the freedom of wanting to be second-hand smoke free that seems to be the push for this law.

[BuLLy-K]

Okay, so you guys don't go to bars or nightclubs? Think realistically. How much revenue is generated? How does that affect us?
I quit and I don't think I'll ever start again but the law does infringe, Pam. That is oppressive and that is totalitarian.
As for second hand smoke, yes it does hurt others.

[BuLLy-K]

I'm not against the ban. I think they should have been more selective and done a trial run in certain area's OR types of locations first.

[BuLLy-K]

i am glad that they passed that law. i hate the smell of smoke........ and it's irritating! some people don't even have any consideration that you're standing right there and they're blowing the smoke right in front of you. i don't want lung cancer! that's why i never did pick up a ciggarette in my life.

Yes, it irritates me too. Even when I did smoke, other people's cigarettes bothered me. I also used to chew tobacco and that was more dangerous but this was years ago.

[Teck808]

Hopefully my mother quits.

[slopokegts]

Okay, so you guys don't go to bars or nightclubs? Think realistically. How much revenue is generated? How does that affect us?

a lot of visitors smoke, and smokers NEED to smoke. so if someone was planning a vacation trip and they find out hawaii has strict laws on smoking, they'll choose someplace else over here. most bars/clubs have mostly locals. but smoked out places like that is one reason i don't go to bars or clubs often.

[BuLLy-K]

Okay, so you guys don't go to bars or nightclubs? Think realistically. How much revenue is generated? How does that affect us?

a lot of visitors smoke, and smokers NEED to smoke. so if someone was planning a vacation trip and they find out hawaii has strict laws on smoking, they'll choose someplace else over here. most bars/clubs have mostly locals. but smoked out places like that is one reason i don't go to bars or clubs often.

Exactly! You got the point: If you don't like smoke, don't go to bars or nightclubs.
The majority of people in these places might not be visitors but they do pass the word around to others when they go home.

[RUSH]

Well, I quit in April or May. I think that the rule is absolutist and totalitarian.

So, sit back and watch. This no smoking law was discussed months ago and it passed. Where was everyone then? There are tens of thousands of smokers in every city here. Where was everyone? The law was given a back seat to the rise in gas prices and anything else that could make the front page of the morning paper.

Yeah it did take a back seat it was like one day I'm reading about how certain politcian is blaming U.S. Military for raise in cost of living in HI. then I see this retarded comercial about "No can Smoke". this was like 2 weeks ago. WTF? I wish I knew who back this up berfore the election date. damn it there just not enough mudslinging in HI politics! :mad:

[skamikaze]

i am glad that they passed that law. i hate the smell of smoke........ and it's irritating! some people don't even have any consideration that you're standing right there and they're blowing the smoke right in front of you. i don't want lung cancer! that's why i never did pick up a ciggarette in my life.

sorry gary....i don't know how this law can be compared to as totalitarian. when i think of totalitarian.....i think about stalin or hitler.............. they made people suffer... i'm pretty sure no one will suffer like that without smoking... i mean they could just walk 20 feet away and smoke... no biggie

im with you pam, cant stand smoke. i have no problems letting friends know about it too, although sometimes they like to play back and blow smoke in my face.
sucks cuz ive dealt with second hand smoke my whole life cuz my grandpa. but cant say anything to him out of respect.
I'm not against the ban. I think they should have been more selective and done a trial run in certain area's OR types of locations first.

i think the trial run was the smoking ban in restaurants. it worked fine with people not grumbling too much, and the japanese tourists (not that they're the only ones that matter, but they probably matter the most) totally understood the rules. everyone thought it would be a big problem then, but it wasnt. i think that gave the powers that be the green light to take it to the next leve.

[BuLLy-K]

If they did that to you, their not your friends. That's just dick of them to blow smoke at you.

Even if the restaurant ban was a trial run, it will be interesting to see what happens now. I mean, if your working in a bar or nightclub and don't like smoke - get another job. Those people knew what the work conditions were like.