downshifting to race or pass up a car

[Itzdavidx]

when you guys are downshifting to pass up a car, race or just to gain some speed do you double clutch or rev match?

[Blue Bomber]

I always double clutch, though some people say it isn't necessary. It's easier on the transmission and you (no whiplash ;) ) than rev matching. I already went through one transmission (a couple synchros gone, some gears grinded, quicker to replace whole tranny) because all I did was rev match when I downshifted, so I always double clutch now. I've had the new tranny for over 30k now, and have no problems with grinding gears or getting into gear.

[MR2 Quik]

I jsut shifted normally, but then again, I went through a tranny in under 8k miles :D

[Blue Bomber]

Originally posted by MR2 Quik
I jsut shifted normally, but then again, I went through a tranny in under 8k miles :D LOL! :) Mine started having troubles around 12k. :gap:

[MR2 Quik]

Yeah, but that's just my luck with cars. Had my Celica for 1 year (Exactly) then it got totaled by an old man.......Bought a MR2 one month later.......the HG blew 3 days later (actually it was already blown, but Block Sealent held up for a bit)........got it back 3 months later.........500 miles later, it blew again.......Still waiting for it to come out of the shop (going on another 3+ months!! :rolleyes:

[t2000gts]

what's the difference between double clutching and rev matching? double clutching you push in clutch, move stick to neutral, let out clutch...rev up to proper rpm, clutch in, move stick to next gear, let out clutch? then what's rev matching if not that?

[Itzdavidx]

do a search on this... i found alot of good information out by searching... double clutching and rev matching are different because when you double clutch then your matching the engine speed or something haha.. there was a good post by gtslaid i think...

[Blue Bomber]

http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18065&highlight=double+synchros

[pokgai]

so basically from what pitcrew said, double clutching is pointless, right? just for fun and impressing your passengers.

[Modern Angel]

Originally posted by Itzdavidx
do a search on this... i found alot of good information out by searching... double clutching and rev matching are different because when you double clutch then your matching the engine speed or something haha.. there was a good post by gtslaid i think...

Yeah, when you double-clutch instead of just rev matching you're matching the speed of the transmission to the speed of the engine.. whereas with rev matching you're just revving up the engine to try and match the speed of the transmission.. the two aren't synced together.. (if that makes sense)

[autxr]

I'll typically only double clutch to first (and needing a downshift to first is a rarity).

To the other gears, I just let the synchro's do their job and do a little rev match to make it smoother.

Of course, that is for when i want to slow down.

If I'm making a downshift to pass I just put it in a lower gear and go. The rev-match is done as the clutch is released (start getting onto the gas).

If you feel the need to double clutch a downshift for a race, and the person you are racing doesn't feel the need, you will lose, they can make the shift faster.

Scott

[The Game]

I just shift normally as well, no tranny problems yet *crosses fingers*

[Itzdavidx]

so lets say you are going to race someone and you need to downshift... you just shove it into the gear?? isnt that kind of bad

[Matty P]

What the Hell are you guys doing to your gearboxes?!?!?! Wearing them out after 8k miles or 12k miles?

I've got 55,000km on my car, I do PLENTY of downshifting (without double clutching or rev-matching) and haven't had any problems. My favourite thing on the highway is to shift from 5th to 3rd at about 90km/h and floor it to overtake.

I'm not criticising ur driving style, but what is the story?

Matty P

[Blue Bomber]

Originally posted by Matty P
What the Hell are you guys doing to your gearboxes?!?!?! Wearing them out after 8k miles or 12k miles?

I've got 55,000km on my car, I do PLENTY of downshifting (without double clutching or rev-matching) and haven't had any problems. My favourite thing on the highway is to shift from 5th to 3rd at about 90km/h and floor it to overtake.

I'm not criticising ur driving style, but what is the story?

Matty P Not a clue. I drive in same style I did with the other tranny, but now I double clutch. I've gone over 36k now without any problems. Go figure.

[gts24]

Double clutch rev matching should be done with extreme care. Somebody once came on here and asked why we'd ever do that, he was an experienced tranny expert.


My 3rd gear sync got FUDGED UP because of improper double clutch rev matching...


I don't think you should do it unless you can absolutely do it properly.

[MR2 Quik]

Well, it wansnt my "bad driving" that did it...the syncro was starting to go out. Factory defect on them. Once I got it fixed, it lasted over 10k miles without a problem. Unfortunately it was totaled, so I cant tell you if it would still be good :(

[autxr]

so lets say you are going to race someone and you need to downshift... you just shove it into the gear?? isnt that kind of bad

Um, no.

Beside, what were you doing in the wrong gear anyhow. The only place a race should be occuring is at a race track, and at a track, the only time you need to downshift is when slowing for a corner, not for trying to get by someone.

For *passing* on the other hand, here is what I do.

I put on my turn signal, I put the clutch in while simultaneously getting off the gas. I then move the gear lever from the gear I am in (5th or 6th), and I select the new one (2nd or 3rd), then as the clutch is coming out, I am revving the engine up to match the new transmission speed. By the time the clutch is engages, the engine and tranny are moving at about the same speed. I change lanes, pass the car, select my cruising gear (5 or 6), signal and move back, then slow back down.

We have synchronized transmissions, let them work as designed.

I've been doing it this way for my 15 years of driving and have never worn out a transmission.

Scott

[gts24]

Originally posted by autxr


Um, no.

Beside, what were you doing in the wrong gear anyhow. The only place a race should be occuring is at a race track, and at a track, the only time you need to downshift is when slowing for a corner, not for trying to get by someone.

For *passing* on the other hand, here is what I do.

I put on my turn signal, I put the clutch in while simultaneously getting off the gas. I then move the gear lever from the gear I am in (5th or 6th), and I select the new one (2nd or 3rd), then as the clutch is coming out, I am revving the engine up to match the new transmission speed. By the time the clutch is engages, the engine and tranny are moving at about the same speed. I change lanes, pass the car, select my cruising gear (5 or 6), signal and move back, then slow back down.

We have synchronized transmissions, let them work as designed.

I've been doing it this way for my 15 years of driving and have never worn out a transmission.

Scott


I totally agree with this. If I hadn't gotten on this whole double clutch rev match kick because of some over generalized BS "knowledge" I would have never had to have my car in for service.

Every other car that I owned that had a manual tranny I did just what Scott said and I never had problems, I started double clutch rev matching my 3rd gear downshift and man did it get fudged up.

[Edison_Chen]

damn i never knew driving stick would be this complecated

[Redline]

Originally posted by autxr


Um, no.

Beside, what were you doing in the wrong gear anyhow. The only place a race should be occuring is at a race track, and at a track, the only time you need to downshift is when slowing for a corner, not for trying to get by someone.

For *passing* on the other hand, here is what I do.

I put on my turn signal, I put the clutch in while simultaneously getting off the gas. I then move the gear lever from the gear I am in (5th or 6th), and I select the new one (2nd or 3rd), then as the clutch is coming out, I am revving the engine up to match the new transmission speed. By the time the clutch is engages, the engine and tranny are moving at about the same speed. I change lanes, pass the car, select my cruising gear (5 or 6), signal and move back, then slow back down.

We have synchronized transmissions, let them work as designed.

I've been doing it this way for my 15 years of driving and have never worn out a transmission.

Scott


I would take Scott's advice over anybody elses here. That's my advice. ;)

[01 Spectra GT-S]

Agree with that scotty dude

[CelicaNamja79]

Agree with Scott's comment. I use both depending on the situation.