jlitman's engine build progress...

[jlitman]

Well, as some of you already know, my #2 piston went kablooie and damaged the cylinder wall, as verified with a borescope.

Haven't done the full teardown yet, but most likely culprit is the piston ring land, as I was getting pretty close to the power levels at which they are known to fail on the stock pistons.

Happened without warning, and while datalogging on the dyno, no less :faint:

Oh well... mess with fire and all... :gap:

So here's what's coming soon...


1. Darton sleeved block from MWR!

2. Forged pistons!

I have a few questions here:

(a) Which is "better" (which could be interpreted as "sturdier", "lighter in weight", etc.), Mahle or Wiseco?

(b) I eventually plan to push the S/C to 16+ psi (more details below), would a 10:1 CR be too high?

3. After the engine is built and break in has passed -- a 2.875" pulley, that should make 16+ psi!

4. IK27 sparkplugs

5. 530 cc SARD injectors. I've checked this using RC's injector calculator, it should be fine for projected bhp and whp, so long as I also get..

6. ...255 lh MWR fuel pump

7. New gauges: intake manfold air temp and EGT to help to evaluate how well the W/I is working

8. Knock sensor connected to emanage ultiamte datalogger (previously, I just monitored timing -- I don't think that's good enough...)

9. (Possibly) the snow performance safe injection system -- it allows boost to blow through the bypass valve if water flow is disrupted.

10. (Possibly... damn it's expensive) J&S Safeguard to pull timing in case of knock

Projected whp is in the 230's (detailed in another thread), so when all is said and done, I should be a happy camper :)

[mukalicious]

i think its their dyno. :shrugs:

[jlitman]

i think its their dyno. :shrugs:

I think it's their reliance on their ear drums for knock detection...

Actually, to be fair tho', I was monitoring and recording ignition timing and a whole mess of other engine parameters the whole time -- there was zero evidence of anything about to go wrong. :shrugs:

Stupid weak-ass pistons :bang:

Speaking of dynos, have you re-dynoed post-break-in? And what's this about you selling your car!?

[mukalicious]

havnet re-dynoed. im coming up to 3500 miles and due for an oil change. after that im going to dyno. but in the meantime, i think i have a leaking headgasket. i get stumbles at idle. so while looking around the engine bay for leaks, me and a buddy of mine located a spot right along the gasket where there is a mixture of oil and coolant. i emailed casey and have yet to get a response, so i may give them a call tomorrow.

i dont know if im selling my car yet. i have good days and bad days with it. and someone hit me again in my work parking lot... so now every panel on the passenger side has some damage. :furious:

[Entranced]

doesn't the greddy charger max it's potential at around 13 psi?


Or is that because of the heat issue... hmm, i forget what i read, correct me if i'm wrong...

Go with 10:1 ratio at the lowest! heck, get forged and stay with 11.5:1. since your sleeving it, you can definatly handle the psi... and it's forged internals, so they aren't gonna break either.


maybe run nitrous with the charger as well?

[jlitman]

doesn't the greddy charger max it's potential at around 13 psi?

Nah. The Ronin has a pulley about the same size as mine, and he's making over 13 psi after the intercooler. Another preson tested this one and claimed over 16 psi, so it should be fine. Won't even redline the blower ;)

Go with 10:1 ratio at the lowest! heck, get forged and stay with 11.5:1. since your sleeving it, you can definatly handle the psi... and it's forged internals, so they aren't gonna break either.


maybe run nitrous with the charger as well?

Hmmm, I'm a bit worried of going over 10:1 -- I have a lot of faith in my W/I, but I don't want to create a set up that forces me to tune conservatively to avoid det -- that might be counter-productive...

Truthfully, so long as it's safe, it will come down to wait time. I don't want to add another month to the wait for custom CR pistons...

N20? Hmmm... tempting, but a decent system will be pricey to set up and then I have to keep refilling the bottle :(

[GrimIndustries]

Are you going to swap to a MT?

[tdunn1981]

Wow, that sucks man. Sorry to hear about your car. If your building the engine, I have to wonder why you are sticking with a blower instead of getting a turbo. I miss lift :(

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

Are you going to swap to a MT?
:werd:, why not do this first off?

[BuRn1nG]

he is still auto? :monkey: Swapping to a MT should have been the first thing on the list.

[jlitman]

How did I fvcking know I would get these kinds of irrelevant comments...

Would you idiots get out of my thread and move me to your ignore list, please.

This is about my engine not my transmission.

Swapping my trans or changing around the whole set-up are not options for me nor are they of interest to me.

I'm rebuilding my motor, upping the boost, and adding some gauges -- that's plenty expensive and time consuming :faint:

[Jesse IL]

I'd like to see a picture of the top of a 9:1 Mahle piston.

[Entranced]

A good n20 setup is roughly $900 for the gear. you can install it yourself, and it costs about $30 to fill a 10lb bottle. Just figured that if you'd be pushing the charger at that higher psi, the n20 would help cool the intake charge as well as give you an added bonus in hp and tq. Since you are building the motor, I think that your charger won't come close to maxing out the internals after the build and it could go for the added boost easily, especially with low comp pistons.

my 2c.

[jlitman]

A good n20 setup is roughly $900 for the gear. you can install it yourself, and it costs about $30 to fill a 10lb bottle. Just figured that if you'd be pushing the charger at that higher psi, the n20 would help cool the intake charge as well as give you an added bonus in hp and tq. Since you are building the motor, I think that your charger won't come close to maxing out the internals after the build and it could go for the added boost easily, especially with low comp pistons.

my 2c.

My bitchy comment was not directed at you or Mukalicious or for that matter at anybody who has useful information / suggestions regarding the engine build.

Hell, you actually responded to my question regarding CR's, which I greatly appreciate :)

I'm looking at a couple of grand when all is said and done for the engine, plus another $700 or so for new gauges and fueling items, so the N20 idea, tho' a good and relatively simple addition to my set-up, will have to wait for another day.

Oh, wait -- I forgot, mixing N20 with W/I is tricky -- you can get ice particles in the IM that way... well, I'll keep it in mind ;)

I'd like to see a picture of the top of a 9:1 Mahle piston.
I see that you found the pics in Smaay's thread -- there's more pics to be found at moremonkey here http://www.monkeytuner.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=915&start=15

[Smaay]

since you are getting sleeved, get the wiesco pistons.

[jlitman]

since you are getting sleeved, get the wiesco pistons.

The nice thing about those is that I can get them in a different CR if I want -- do you think 10:1 (or greater) is ill advised?

Any idea how the weight of the Wisecos compares to the Mahles?

[Gravel]

How did I fvcking know I would get these kinds of irrelevant comments...

Would you idiots get out of my thread and move me to your ignore list, please.

This is about my engine not my transmission.

Swapping my trans or changing around the whole set-up are not options for me nor are they of interest to me.

I'm rebuilding my motor, upping the boost, and adding some gauges -- that's plenty expensive and time consuming :faint:

I'm glad to see you're going sleeved Jiltman, it'll be worth it in the longrun :)

I'm also glad you told these idiots where to get off - personally I'd love an auto box in my Gen 7 - as long as it was the dual-clutch jobbie from a Golf GTI that has no slushie and changes gears in 8ms!
http://cars.about.com/od/thingsyouneedtoknow/a/ag_howDSGworks.htm
Hmm, now that's a project...

Anyway, good luck with your engine build - I'm sure it's going to be interesting for the rest of us :)

Cheers.

[jlitman]

How did I fvcking know I would get these kinds of irrelevant comments...

Would you idiots get out of my thread and move me to your ignore list, please.

This is about my engine not my transmission.

Swapping my trans or changing around the whole set-up are not options for me nor are they of interest to me.

I'm rebuilding my motor, upping the boost, and adding some gauges -- that's plenty expensive and time consuming :faint:

I'm glad to see you're going sleeved Jiltman, it'll be worth it in the longrun :)

I'm also glad you told these idiots where to get off - personally I'd love an auto box in my Gen 7 - as long as it was the dual-clutch jobbie from a Golf GTI that has no slushie and changes gears in 8ms!
http://cars.about.com/od/thingsyouneedtoknow/a/ag_howDSGworks.htm
Hmm, now that's a project...

Anyway, good luck with your engine build - I'm sure it's going to be interesting for the rest of us :)

Cheers.

Hey, a DSG would be awesome to be sure, but to be honest, I'm perfectly happy with my slushbox, which seems to actually work, whereas my engine reaaaaallly needs fixing. :gap:

Speaking of which, I think I'm adding an AT fluid temp gauge to my list -- I'll have an extra pod hole to fill, so why not? :shrugs: Once I put that new pulley on, I'll be making about 10 psi when I tap the gas, so brake-stand launches should be lots of fun, and I might as well have a way of monitoring how badly the fluid is cooking.

I've cleared off my cc, so I'm very close to making the final order for the sleeved block and pistons. All I need to do now is decide whether a custom CR is worth the wait :)

[Jesse IL]

since you are getting sleeved, get the wiesco pistons.

Definitely. What they do is sleeve the block, then when they get the pistons, they final hone the sleeves based on the size of the pistons.

I have no real opinion on 9:1 vs. 10:1 since I've never seen a direct comparison. I picked 10:1 because I anticipated running boost levels in the mid teens.

[jlitman]

since you are getting sleeved, get the wiesco pistons.

Definitely. What they do is sleeve the block, then when they get the pistons, they final hone the sleeves based on the size of the pistons.

I have no real opinion on 9:1 vs. 10:1 since I've never seen a direct comparison. I picked 10:1 because I anticipated running boost levels in the mid teens.

Okay, thanks :) Guess I'll see what they say regarding CR -- I'm going to call and order today or tomorrow, so I'll keep everyone posted on what I get.

[Entranced]

get 10, not 9... you'd be dropping 2.5 CR... you'd be losing too much power that way to then have to up the boost again to get it back to normal...

since your sleeved and all, i'd say get as close to 11.5:1 without going over would be your best bet for power. i wouldn't get 9:1.. it's too low from the oem.


next up: tranny rebuild kit =P

[Smaay]

id go with Jesse here too. get the 10:1 pistons. they will be a little more responsive

[BuRn1nG]

How did I fvcking know I would get these kinds of irrelevant comments...

Would you idiots get out of my thread and move me to your ignore list, please.

This is about my engine not my transmission.

Swapping my trans or changing around the whole set-up are not options for me nor are they of interest to me.

I'm rebuilding my motor, upping the boost, and adding some gauges -- that's plenty expensive and time consuming :faint:


your a damn idiot for spending so much on an auto build.
anyone with a head on their shoulders would transfer to MT before digging any deeper.

[the ronin]

Jiltman the Mahle's are fine if you could post the pics from www.moremonkey.com and there is zero response issue with the lower comp., remember you're blown not turboed.....but hey what do I know...Oh yeaah if you had the new padle shifting 8 speed you'd goo soooo much more better dude..

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

your a damn idiot for spending so much on an auto build.
anyone with a head on their shoulders would transfer to MT before digging any deeper.
Well, not necessarily. The tranny doesn't suck THAT much. And he's happy with it, so it's fine.

[22xy]

You should consider the Hydra if you are going to buy the JS safeguard. The Hydra will pull timing and has loads of other features (like controlling water injection), although make sure you have a tuner in the area who knows how to tune it. I'm sure you know this already, but make sure if you get the Mahle pistons that they are the new generation with the correctly matched valve reliefs.

[jlitman]

your a damn idiot for spending so much on an auto build.
anyone with a head on their shoulders would transfer to MT before digging any deeper.
Pretty funny coming from someone widely regarded as a complete idiot. At worst I'm a fool for suping up a slow car; you're a hopeless moron no matter what you do.

Would you idiots get out of my thread and move me to your ignore list, please.
Hey, you obnoxious jerk, read that again. Get someone to help you if needed. BTW, stupid, did you miss the part where I said I blew a piston and need to get it fixed? While I'm at it, I'm beefing it up and adding more boost too.

Now do me a favor sh!t-for-brains, since you have absolutely no knowledge of anything of any use to anyone around here, why don't you run along and go harass someone else -- oh wait you're doing that in another thread right now too aren't you? Wow, you suck.

Jiltman the Mahle's are fine if you could post the pics from www.moremonkey.com and there is zero response issue with the lower comp., remember you're blown not turboed.....but hey what do I know...Oh yeaah if you had the new padle shifting 8 speed you'd goo soooo much more better dude..

Griffin (Boosted / Dave) said the same thing, that I wouldn't even notice the difference off boost. I'm going to see how long the wait would be -- if it adds no more than a week or two, I'll do it. If it adds a month or more, I'll stick with the lower comps pistons.

I called today to place my order, but no answer. Guess I'll try again tomorrow...

Thanks, guys, for all of the helpful advice.

Oh, and fvck you very much, Burning. Say, how'd you get that name anyway? Got the sh!ts real bad or something?

You should consider the Hydra if you are going to buy the JS safeguard. The Hydra will pull timing and has loads of other features (like controlling water injection), although make sure you have a tuner in the area who knows how to tune it. I'm sure you know this already, but make sure if you get the Mahle pistons that they are the new generation with the correctly matched valve reliefs.

I've thought about it, but it's out of my price range -- the engine rebuild has diminished funds that were going towards new engine management.

All things considered, I've got the emanage working pretty well. Didn't know the Hydra had a safe guard setting tho'-- pretty awesome!

Yep, I know all about the Mahle valve relief issue. There's a bunch of info on moremoneky about it. Not sure yet if I'm getting the wisecos or the mahles -- I know the Wisecos can be purchased at CR's other than 8.8 tho', so that alone makes them desirable.

I just spoke with my tuner / engine builder -- he seems to think we can rig up a simple indicator light to warn us when the ECU sees knock, and I'm also looking at getting a W/I safeguard that controls the bypass valve on the S/C -- if water flow is disrupted, it opens the valve and lets the boost out -- just need to see how tunable it is.

[22xy]

I just spoke with my tuner / engine builder -- he seems to think we can rig up a simple indicator light to warn us when the ECU sees knock, and I'm also looking at getting a W/I safeguard that controls the bypass valve on the S/C -- if water flow is disrupted, it opens the valve and lets the boost out -- just need to see how tunable it is.

That's pretty cool! Let me know how it works out for you. :) You might be even able to activate the map switch on the Emanage Ultimate, so it will switch to a non-W/I map.

[BuRn1nG]

Pretty funny coming from someone widely regarded as a complete idiot. At worst I'm a fool for suping up a slow car; you're a hopeless moron no matter what you do.


Hey, you obnoxious jerk, read that again. Get someone to help you if needed. BTW, stupid, did you miss the part where I said I blew a piston and need to get it fixed? While I'm at it, I'm beefing it up and adding more boost too.

Now do me a favor sh!t-for-brains, since you have absolutely no knowledge of anything of any use to anyone around here, why don't you run along and go harass someone else -- oh wait you're doing that in another thread right now too aren't you? Wow, you suck.


Griffin (Boosted / Dave) said the same thing, that I wouldn't even notice the difference off boost. I'm going to see how long the wait would be -- if it adds no more than a week or two, I'll do it. If it adds a month or more, I'll stick with the lower comps pistons.

I called today to place my order, but no answer. Guess I'll try again tomorrow...

Thanks, guys, for all of the helpful advice.

Oh, and fvck you very much, Burning. Say, how'd you get that name anyway? Got the sh!ts real bad or something?


I've thought about it, but it's out of my price range -- the engine rebuild has diminished funds that were going towards new engine management.

All things considered, I've got the emanage working pretty well. Didn't know the Hydra had a safe guard setting tho'-- pretty awesome!

Yep, I know all about the Mahle valve relief issue. There's a bunch of info on moremoneky about it. Not sure yet if I'm getting the wisecos or the mahles -- I know the Wisecos can be purchased at CR's other than 8.8 tho', so that alone makes them desirable.

I just spoke with my tuner / engine builder -- he seems to think we can rig up a simple indicator light to warn us when the ECU sees knock, and I'm also looking at getting a W/I safeguard that controls the bypass valve on the S/C -- if water flow is disrupted, it opens the valve and lets the boost out -- just need to see how tunable it is.

I am widely regarded as an idiot? by who? You and who else? thats what I thought.
Your the complete dumbass for trying to put so much money into an auto tranny that is known not to handle much power. :monkey:
And knowledge? I have more knowledge than most people on this site idiot.
IF YOU had the knowledge, then you wouldnt be making the mistakes you are.
Just admit that you are a redneck prick who has no future. :fawk:

Sometimes the truth is hard to handle, and in your case, you sound very much butt-hurt from what I have said. Quit taking life like a little bitch.

[jlitman]

Just admit that you are a redneck prick who has no future. :fawk:

:laugh: That's about the funniest thing I think you've ever said. Yeah, you sure have me pegged. Yep, I'm an uneducated, unemployed manual laborer from FL who drinks moonshine and PBR and has an "insured by Smith & Wesson" sticker on my Chevy pick up. Well spotted. How did you know? Are you stalking me?

BTW, dumbass, did you know MWR is building a FWD drag car out of (drum roll) an automatic GT-S. Yep, stock slush box and all, though they will be installing a manual valve body for faster shifts. They plan to push over 500 whp on it. Maybe you should give Matt a call at MWR and advise him accordingly. I'm sure he'd appreciate it.

Run along, youngster, I'm sure mom and dad don't want you tying up the cable modem all night arguing with rednecks like me.

And if your advice was not to repair my engine, then thanks for nothing.

Are we done now? Do you need to get the last word? Get in the last round of fapping in my thread then.

Thanks for contributing absolutely nothing in both my thread and DYI01's thread on tuning the WR header. Well done.

[jlitman]

I just spoke with my tuner / engine builder -- he seems to think we can rig up a simple indicator light to warn us when the ECU sees knock, and I'm also looking at getting a W/I safeguard that controls the bypass valve on the S/C -- if water flow is disrupted, it opens the valve and lets the boost out -- just need to see how tunable it is.

That's pretty cool! Let me know how it works out for you. :) You might be even able to activate the map switch on the Emanage Ultimate, so it will switch to a non-W/I map.

That's a very good idea -- I've been thinking that using the remote switch for a safety map would be a worthwhile addition, and it's relatively inexpensive to set up.

[BuRn1nG]

:laugh: That's about the funniest thing I think you've ever said. Yeah, you sure have me pegged. Yep, I'm an uneducated, unemployed manual laborer from FL who drinks moonshine and PBR and has an "insured by Smith & Wesson" sticker on my Chevy pick up. Well spotted. How did you know? Are you stalking me?

Im sure there are more details that you are not disclosing to us.

[jlitman]

:laugh: That's about the funniest thing I think you've ever said. Yeah, you sure have me pegged. Yep, I'm an uneducated, unemployed manual laborer from FL who drinks moonshine and PBR and has an "insured by Smith & Wesson" sticker on my Chevy pick up. Well spotted. How did you know? Are you stalking me?

Im sure there are more details that you are not disclosing to us.

Yeah, I'm also fvcking your mother. Her back is a little hairy, but her personality makes up for it.

[BuRn1nG]

:laugh: That's about the funniest thing I think you've ever said. Yeah, you sure have me pegged. Yep, I'm an uneducated, unemployed manual laborer from FL who drinks moonshine and PBR and has an "insured by Smith & Wesson" sticker on my Chevy pick up. Well spotted. How did you know? Are you stalking me?

BTW, dumbass, did you know MWR is building a FWD drag car out of (drum roll) an automatic GT-S. Yep, stock slush box and all, though they will be installing a manual valve body for faster shifts. They plan to push over 500 whp on it. Maybe you should give Matt a call at MWR and advise him accordingly. I'm sure he'd appreciate it.

Run along, youngster, I'm sure mom and dad don't want you tying up the cable modem all night arguing with rednecks like me.

And if your advice was not to repair my engine, then thanks for nothing.

Are we done now? Do you need to get the last word? Get in the last round of fapping in my thread then.

Thanks for contributing absolutely nothing in both my thread and DYI01's thread on tuning the WR header. Well done.

very immature for a 35 year old who still drives a celica and argues with "youngsters" like me. I am sure this is the type of satisfaction you look to in life. You are very representative of white trash and I am positive there is plenty of it down in florida

[BuRn1nG]

Yeah, I'm also fvcking your mother. Her back is a little hairy, but her personality makes up for it.

wow, here come the insults :gay: :rolleyes:
did you think that up all by yourself.

Just end it now and put a cheese grater to your face.

[jlitman]

very immature for a 35 year old who still drives a celica and argues with "youngsters" like me. I am sure this is the type of satisfaction you look to in life. You are very representative of white trash and I am positive there is plenty of it down in florida
Hey, if you were a citizen of France, I'd have to try and converse in French to get through to you. Given that you're an obnoxious, childish jerk who can't take a hint, I will respond in kind.

Shouldn't you be doing some community service right now?

[BuRn1nG]

Hey, if you were a citizen of France, I'd have to try and converse in French to get through to you. Given that you're an obnoxious, childish jerk who can't take a hint, I will respond in kind.

Shouldn't you be doing some community service right now?

No, im sorry I am not going to have some dick trash talk to me and insult my character without response.

And why are you all the sudden caring about my matters?

We can go all day buddy, or we can end this on a different note.

[drewd]

Only 230whp? I thought you were already ~250? :confused:

[jlitman]

Hey, if you were a citizen of France, I'd have to try and converse in French to get through to you. Given that you're an obnoxious, childish jerk who can't take a hint, I will respond in kind.

Shouldn't you be doing some community service right now?

No, im sorry I am not going to have some dick trash talk to me and insult my character without response.

And why are you all the sudden caring about my matters?

We can go all day buddy, or we can end this on a different note.

We don't have to end it on a different note -- this is fun for me. But do me a favor, start an OT thread and trash talk me all you like -- that would be awesome!

All you're doing here is clogging up a thread that may be of interest to others with a lot of crap to weed through to in order to find the odd nugget of wisdom.

Your point about it being ill advised to mod the AT GT-S, got it. I'll write it down so I don't forget. Thanks so much for that -- where would I be without you?

Now would you mind if I continue to discuss the repair and fortification of my engine without your hilarious antics, or what?

[jlitman]

Only 230whp? I thought you were already ~250? :confused:

That's quite possibly a conservative estimate. (example of how I arrived at this value can be found here (http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3677764&postcount=90)). It depends in part on (1) The CR of the pistons (yet to be determined), (2) the amount of boost made by my new pulley (could be as much as 17 psi according to milesplume), (3) and of course tuning.

Before my piston went pop, I was around 213 whp and 144 wtq (see link in sig). The last pull, I still made over 186 -- not bad for a sick engine.

Also, that's on XAT's dyno where lightly modded 6-speeds don't break 155 whp. Remember, the numbers are all relative ;)

[Gravel]

Can the Ultimate actually switch maps on the fly from the front panel DIP switches, or does it need that crappy Greddy switching kit? :shrugs:

As for water failure, just get a f'ing huge red light and a 200dB siren on your dash to remind you to pull over and refill the water tank :AF:

As for all this transmission crap - for feck's sake - it's his bloody car, let him have whatever bloody transmission he wants :rolleyes:

Shame on you though Jiltman - on two counts:

1) You've clearly forgotten - Never argue with idiots!

2) Forget building your engine, you just know your car will run like crap unless you respray it in my favourite colour ;)

[Gravel]

That's quite possibly a conservative estimate. (example of how I arrived at this vlaue can be found here (http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3677764&postcount=90)). It depends in part on (1) The CR of the pistons (yet to be determined), (2) the amount of boost made by my new pulley (could be as much as 17 psi accoridng to milesplume), (3) and of course tuning.

Before my piston went pop, I was around 213 whp and 144 wtq (see link in sig). The last pull, I still made over 186 -- not bad for a sick engine.

Also, that's on XAT's dyno where lightly modded 6-speeds don't break 155 whp. Remember, the numbers are all relative ;)

If you know where to find one, I guess you could actually have your engine dyno'ed on an engine dyno before it goes back into your car :naughty:

[jlitman]

Can the Ultimate actually switch maps on the fly from the front panel DIP switches, or does it need that crappy Greddy switching kit? :shrugs:

As for water failure, just get a f'ing huge red light and a 200dB siren on your dash to remind you to pull over and refill the water tank :AF:

As for all this transmission crap - for feck's sake - it's his bloody car, let him have whatever bloody transmission he wants :rolleyes:

Shame on you though Jiltman - on two counts:

1) You've clearly forgotten - Never argue with idiots!

2) Forget building your engine, you just know your car will run like crap unless you respray it in my favourite colour ;)

Ha ha ha ha! Well, an ornery redneck like me just can't help himself!

I should start a thread called "It's My Money, Your Jerkoff Fantasy: Build My Car the Way YOU Want!" :laugh:

Maybe I'll get a big turbo V-8 dropped in there. I'm definitely getting the 8-speed paddle shifter trans then! And yes, we can paint it any color you like, mate :chuckles:

Now that you mention it... maybe it can't switch on the fly... This came up once before, but I can't recall the outcome.

I've never let the water tank go dry, but that doesn't mean a line didn't clog on #2, thus reducing flow. We'll be installing some easily accessed inline filters for sure.

If you know where to find one, I guess you could actually have your engine dyno'ed on an engine dyno before it goes back into your car :naughty:

Hmmm... food for thought. Ya know, I think just for sh!ts and grins, I'll see if I can locate one around here.

[drewd]

hmm. Good luck with everything.

Right now I'm stuck between going balls to the wall N/A or supercharging my GT.
The problem is finding someone willing to give up their trd sc.

[Entranced]

what are you planning on using that will let you know if the lines are clogged?

[Gravel]

I've never let the water tank go dry, but that doesn't mean a line didn't clog on #2, thus reducing flow. We'll be installing some easily accessed inline filters for sure.

How are you going to monitor that though - pressure sensor per sprayer - will that spot blocked nozzles though?

Weren't you talking about measuring EGT's a while back? Would EGT give you much of a warning before you got dangerous knock :shrugs:

[jlitman]

hmm. Good luck with everything.

Right now I'm stuck between going balls to the wall N/A or supercharging my GT.
The problem is finding someone willing to give up their trd sc.

Thanks, bro :)

Hmm. Well, considering that even the TRD S/C will be a custom job (and even require a new hood!), and it's an older gen blower (less efficient), you might want to look into a rotrex set up. Did you check out the old and new thread on that?

The other option would be a turbo, but you'd definitely want to consider getting forged rods -- those tend to be the weak link on the 1ZZ.

[BuRn1nG]

Ha ha ha ha! Well, an ornery redneck like me just can't help himself!

I should start a thread called "It's My Money, Your Jerkoff Fantasy: Build My Car the Way YOU Want!" :laugh:

Maybe I'll get a big turbo V-8 dropped in there. I'm definitely getting the 8-speed paddle shifter trans then! And yes, we can paint it any color you like, mate :chuckles:

Now that you mention it... maybe it can't switch on the fly... This came up once before, but I can't recall the outcome.

I've never let the water tank go dry, but that doesn't mean a line didn't clog on #2, thus reducing flow. We'll be installing some easily accessed inline filters for sure.


Hmmm... food for thought. Ya know, I think just for sh!ts and grins, I'll see if I can locate one around here.

You can build your car anyway you want, but you posted this information on this forum, so you were looking to be critisized about your build and/or car. I hope you can fit that sentence into your head, it might be a little too much for your redneck brain.

[Gravel]

If you know where to find one, I guess you could actually have your engine dyno'ed on an engine dyno before it goes back into your car :chuckles:
Hmmm... food for thought. Ya know, I think just for sh!ts and grins, I'll see if I can locate one around here.

On this side of the pond, sh!ts and grins are what you get after a load of beer and curry ;)

[jlitman]

what are you planning on using that will let you know if the lines are clogged?



I've never let the water tank go dry, but that doesn't mean a line didn't clog on #2, thus reducing flow. We'll be installing some easily accessed inline filters for sure.

How are you going to monitor that though - pressure sensor per sprayer - will that spot blocked nozzles though?

Weren't you talking about measuring EGT's a while back? Would EGT give you much of a warning before you got dangerous knock :shrugs:

Yep, EGT's -- though my tuner just told me that the IM temp gauge Ijust purchased may not be useful (D'OH!!!). They should be useful for letting me know what's going on.

For the W/I I was thinking about incorporating this with the eaton S/C bypass solenoid

http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=13

http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=34

Individual pressure sensors for each line would be another option, but doesn't fit so well under the hood and kinda pricey.

[many]

Burningbut would you please Shut the f u c k up...something that you don't approve about his choice of modding is exactly that !...his choice.
What in the world does it mater to you?
And I'm 38 years old and I don't give a crap ass if everyone thinks I'm too old for a Celicagirlycar....but they sure have a different attitude once they have been beaten by it.

Jlitman congrats on the awesome work you are still doing...If only everybody that jumps into FI was that thorough..

[drewd]

hmm. Good luck with everything.

Right now I'm stuck between going balls to the wall N/A or supercharging my GT.
The problem is finding someone willing to give up their trd sc.

Thanks, bro :)

Hmm. Well, considering that even the TRD S/C will be a custom job (and even require a new hood!), and it's an older gen blower (less efficient), you might want to look into a rotrex set up. Did you check out the old and new thread on that?

The other option would be a turbo, but you'd definitely want to consider getting forged rods -- those tend to be the weak link on the 1ZZ.


Well price is a big factor, and with my new paint job I'm going to need a cf hood anyway. I've seen the sc kit go for 800-1000 on mr-s/corolla/matrix forums and it has been confirmed that the belt with the kit works and the trd ecu. New TB's go for $50 on ebay. My dealership estimated 550-600 for install and all that wire splicing with the ecu.
I'm just aiming to kill stock a stock GT-S and have way more low-mid TQ for DD.

Ok, I'm done OTing your thread ;)

[jlitman]

Hmmm... food for thought. Ya know, I think just for sh!ts and grins, I'll see if I can locate one around here.

On this side of the pond, sh!ts and grins are what you get after a load of beer and curry ;)

I do enjoy curry! It causes some BuRn1nG from the ass, tho'.

[jlitman]

Burningbut would you please Shut the f u c k up...something that you don't approve about his choice of modding is exactly that !...his choice.
What in the world does it mater to you?
And I'm 38 years old and I don't give a crap ass if everyone thinks I'm too old for a Celicagirlycar....but they sure have a different attitude once they have been beaten by it.

Jlitman congrats on the awesome work you are still doing...If only everybody that jumps into FI was that thorough..
Thank you, sir. This simple country bumpkin apreciates your support.


Thanks, bro :)

Hmm. Well, considering that even the TRD S/C will be a custom job (and even require a new hood!), and it's an older gen blower (less efficient), you might want to look into a rotrex set up. Did you check out the old and new thread on that?

The other option would be a turbo, but you'd definitely want to consider getting forged rods -- those tend to be the weak link on the 1ZZ.


Well price is a big factor, and with my new paint job I'm going to need a cf hood anyway. I've seen the sc kit go for 800-1000 on mr-s/corolla/matrix forums and it has been confirmed that the belt with the kit works and the trd ecu. New TB's go for $50 on ebay. My dealership estimated 550-600 for install and all that wire splicing with the ecu.
I'm just aiming to kill stock a stock GT-S and have way more low-mid TQ for DD.

Ok, I'm done OTing your thread ;)

Pretty sweet! I'd hold out for the TRD S/C then -- can you also get hold of the ECU? How much is the kit going for from distributors? You might also look for the Vibe kit -- same blower, and should use same brackets and such -- it won't have an ECU you can use, but you could get an emanage to run everything

[BuRn1nG]

Burningbut would you please Shut the f u c k up...something that you don't approve about his choice of modding is exactly that !...his choice.
What in the world does it mater to you?
And I'm 38 years old and I don't give a crap ass if everyone thinks I'm too old for a Celicagirlycar....but they sure have a different attitude once they have been beaten by it.

Jlitman congrats on the awesome work you are still doing...If only everybody that jumps into FI was that thorough..

I KNOW it is HIS choice. I just a made a simple statement. yet I got harrassed in return. You would know that if your head wasnt stuck up your ass.

[BuRn1nG]

I do enjoy curry! It causes some BuRn1nG from the ass, tho'.

....and I enjoy ravaging you mom.

[drewd]

Pretty sweet! I'd hold out for the TRD S/C then -- can you also get hold of the ECU? How much is the kit going for from distributors? You might also look for the Vibe kit -- same blower, and should use same brackets and such -- it won't have an ECU you can use, but you could get an emanage to run everything


See that's the problem, TRD discontinued the supercharger a little while ago. I would have to find a used one. The whole idea of the trd sc was that I woudn't neccessarily need costly tuning/guages etc.

The vibe kit is a good idea though, I'll do some investigating..

[jlitman]

I do enjoy curry! It causes some BuRn1nG from the ass, tho'.

....and I enjoy ravaging you mom.

How many people have to tell you to go away before you do? You're like a giant herpetic lesion or something... Start a thread called "jlitman is a big stupid-head" or soemething -- quit posting a lot of crap here. Jeez, take a fvcking hint!

You just don't get it...

My engine is damaged and I need to fix it.

In the course of fixing it, it will not cost much more to make it stronger.

Given that I'm making the engine stronger, it will be able to withstand more boost.

As luck would have it, I already have a smaller pulley on hand, so I might as well use it.

Got it?

If you wanted to crticize my choice to begin modding it in the first place, you are about two years too late. Point of no return was crossed long ago. Your advice is not helpful, your criticism was irrelevant and duly noted a while ago.

GO AWAY

[the ronin]

Jiltman I see hangin out with monkeys is rubin off....Your best bet for checking water injection woud be a good EGT, once you have a base temp you will know if things get too hot......and hey you could allways use it with your new turbo ?....

[jlitman]

Pretty sweet! I'd hold out for the TRD S/C then -- can you also get hold of the ECU? How much is the kit going for from distributors? You might also look for the Vibe kit -- same blower, and should use same brackets and such -- it won't have an ECU you can use, but you could get an emanage to run everything


See that's the problem, TRD discontinued the supercharger a little while ago. I would have to find a used one. The whole idea of the trd sc was that I woudn't neccessarily need costly tuning/guages etc.

The vibe kit is a good idea though, I'll do some investigating..

I could swear I've seen the TRD S/C for sale from a few places, tho I don't know about the ECU. Being able to tune is a good thing -- again, it's still a custom kit ;)

[the ronin]

Yo burning you are a major dick head.....now get off your sister and get those Happy meals in the bag....

[jlitman]

Jiltman I see hangin out with monkeys is rubin off....Your best bet for checking water injection woud be a good EGT, once you have a base temp you will know if things get too hot......and hey you could allways use it with your new turbo ?....

Heh -- I've always been kind of an asshole when provoked -- I just usually save it for OT.

Turbo and RWD are next two mods. I'm made of money. Oh, and a gun rack -- gotta have a gun rack :gap:

[drewd]

Wow, I had no idea the vibe sc was the TRD with the GM name slapped on it.
Apparently GM bought the rights to market it.

There's going to be a lot of angry rednecks ranting and raving about "those dam chin chans taking over old fashun GM racin!! "

[jlitman]

Wow, I had no idea the vibe sc was the TRD with the GM name slapped on it.
Apparently GM bought the rights to market it.

Yep -- and that might just mean it will be easier to track down ;)

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

Wow, I had no idea the vibe sc was the TRD with the GM name slapped on it.
Apparently GM bought the rights to market it.

There's going to be a lot of angry rednecks ranting and raving about "those dam chin chans taking over old fashun GM racin!! "
Yup, it's a lot easier... and cheaper. This is the parts number (manual version)
http://tunersource.gmblogs.com/Accessories/Engine-Parts/vibe-supercharger-kit-1/
Description: Add up to 30 percent more power and 18 percent more torque to your 2003-2004 Vibe, for new power outputs of 170 HP and 150 lb.-ft. of torque compared to the stock 1.8L engine. Supercharger produces up to 7.5 pounds of boost. Kit includes mounting brackets, air ducts, serpentine drive belt, PCV hoses, new fuel injectors and add-on controller for calibration of the Vehicle Control Module.
A quick search at www.gmpartscheap.com showed a new price of $2246. That was my first search and it was the cheapest compared to the other searches I made right thereafter.

I don't know if that ECU piggyback would work though....

[BuRn1nG]

Yo burning you are a major dick head.....now get off your sister and get those Happy meals in the bag....

who the **** are you? and was I even talking to your cheddar face? get the **** outa here. :eslap:

[BuRn1nG]

How many people have to tell you to go away before you do? You're like a giant herpetic lesion or something... Start a thread called "jlitman is a big stupid-head" or soemething -- quit posting a lot of crap here. Jeez, take a fvcking hint!

You just don't get it...

My engine is damaged and I need to fix it.

In the course of fixing it, it will not cost much more to make it stronger.

Given that I'm making the engine stronger, it will be able to withstand more boost.

As luck would have it, I already have a smaller pulley on hand, so I might as well use it.

Got it?

If you wanted to crticize my choice to begin modding it in the first place, you are about two years too late. Point of no return was crossed long ago. Your advice is not helpful, your criticism was irrelevant and duly noted a while ago.

GO AWAY

the more you keep harrassing me, the longer I will stay here. So you need to take the ****ing hint *******.

[jlitman]

How am I harassing you? I started a thread about my engine build and you came along with zero relevant information or commentary.

If by "harass" you mean I am responding to your idiotic and pointless posts with invective speech, then take note you have earned the "harassment" of several folks besides me at this point.

I guess we're all in the wrong.

Sure, man, knock yourself out. Post all the crap you like. We're all here for you -- the whole thread is about you now anyway.

It's behavior like this that makes you "widely regarded as an idiot", BTW.

[Jesse IL]

How many people have to tell you to go away before you do? You're like a giant herpetic lesion or something... Start a thread called "jlitman is a big stupid-head" or soemething -- quit posting a lot of crap here. Jeez, take a fvcking hint!

You just don't get it...

My engine is damaged and I need to fix it.

In the course of fixing it, it will not cost much more to make it stronger.

Given that I'm making the engine stronger, it will be able to withstand more boost.

As luck would have it, I already have a smaller pulley on hand, so I might as well use it.

Got it?

If you wanted to crticize my choice to begin modding it in the first place, you are about two years too late. Point of no return was crossed long ago. Your advice is not helpful, your criticism was irrelevant and duly noted a while ago.

GO AWAY

the more you keep harrassing me, the longer I will stay here. So you need to take the ****ing hint *******.

I may not be the moderator of this particular forum, but I would highly suggest you stop trolling this thread.

[BuRn1nG]

How am I harassing you? I started a thread about my engine build and you came along with zero relevant information or commentary.

If by "harass" you mean I am responding to your idiotic and pointless posts with invective speech, then take note you have earned the "harassment" of several folks besides me at this point.

I guess we're all in the wrong.

Sure, man, knock yourself out. Post all the crap you like. We're all here for you -- the whole thread is about you now anyway.

It's behavior like this that makes you "widely regarded as an idiot", BTW.

if you werent such an ******* this arguement would hav never happened. but i guess you have the need to show off.

[BuRn1nG]

I may not be the moderator of this particular forum, but I would highly suggest you stop trolling this thread.

will do. nothing good has come out this poinless arguement.

[Celicahzn]

The nice thing about those is that I can get them in a different CR if I want -- do you think 10:1 (or greater) is ill advised?

Any idea how the weight of the Wisecos compares to the Mahles?

yea it sounds about right, try it. you can always change the compression with the wisecos, when you want to. to any other CR so you feel safer. don't go to low or your gonna be making the same power at a higher boost level.

[jlitman]

The nice thing about those is that I can get them in a different CR if I want -- do you think 10:1 (or greater) is ill advised?

Any idea how the weight of the Wisecos compares to the Mahles?

yea it sounds about right, try it. you can always change the compression with the wisecos, when you want to. to any other CR so you feel safer. don't go to low or your gonna be making the same power at a higher boost level.

Yep. I've worked out the calculations, and it comes out to be about a 4-6% reduction in power output. See this post for details and relevant links http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3677764&postcount=90

Basically, I'd need at least another 2 psi to make up the difference. As luck would have it, I have a pulley on hand that should make 4 to 5 more psi than my current one :gap:

[wts]

http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=13
http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=34
I have this very setup on my turbo 1zz.
Yes, Im using the supercharger solenoid because neither of the turbocharger solenoids worked with my manual boost controller.

If they have an option for a better flowing solenoid, get it or you might get 2-3PSI boost spikes. Are those even possible with a SC?

If you use the SI-05 to dump boost instead of swapping maps(can the EMU even do that?) AND you still have a MAF, not MAP, based tune then you will be running way too much fuel. Albeit briefly.

Also, I dont know what sort of nozzles you've got but the smallest you can use with the SI-05 are 175mm/min. Otherwise the flow rate is below its minimum and it will intermittantly detect a no-flow condition.

[jlitman]

http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=13
http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=34
I have this very setup on my turbo 1zz.
Yes, Im using the supercharger solenoid because neither of the turbocharger solenoids worked with my manual boost controller.

If they have an option for a better flowing solenoid, get it or you might get 2-3PSI boost spikes. Are those even possible with a SC?

If you use the SI-05 to dump boost instead of swapping maps(can the EMU even do that?) AND you still have a MAF, not MAP, based tune then you will be running way too much fuel. Albeit briefly.

Also, I dont know what sort of nozzles you've got but the smallest you can use with the SI-05 are 175mm/min. Otherwise the flow rate is below its minimum and it will intermittantly detect a no-flow condition.

I have 4 injectors, and each flows a maximum of 1 gallon/hour or 76 CC/min. It's a progressive controller, so it will flow less than that at spray onset.

My only concern is that I no longer have my water injection come on below 4 psi... So long as I can tune the safe injection system to only be activated at a specified RPM, then I should be fine.

I have an opportunity to pick one up really cheap, but if I can't control when it activates, it'll force me to begin spraying at 1 psi if I want to use it...

[the ronin]

Jiltman what's your smallest pully size ?

[Gravel]

I have 4 injectors, and each flows a maximum of 1 gallon/hour or 76 CC/min. It's a progressive controller, so it will flow less than that at spray onset.

My only concern is that I no longer have my water injection come on below 4 psi... So long as I can tune the safe injection system to only be activated at a specified RPM, then I should be fine.

I have an opportunity to pick one up really cheap, but if I can't control when it activates, it'll force me to begin spraying at 1 psi if I want to use it...

Have you used the digital output on the eManage for anything? If not, there's a map just for it - it's supposed to be used to switch VTECH or something, but you could always wire a relay in series with the boost saftey thing to disable the solenoid. Disabling your safety's is all a bit crazy to me though - remember Chernobyl? :AF:

[Gravel]

Jiltman what's your smallest pully size ?

:werd: Has your MP62 got any more rpm to give? :shrugs:

[jlitman]

Jiltman what's your smallest pully size ?

:werd: Has your MP62 got any more rpm to give? :shrugs:

2.875"

According to my pulley calculator, the smallest you can go is ~2.7" give or take a couple of tenths without hitting the presumed 16K blower redline at 8.5K engine RPM.

Jeez, I hope we're not cutting the life of the blower in half with all of these itty-bitty pulleys...

Anyway, guys, email me at jlitman@shell.cas.usf.edu and I'll send you the MP62 pulley calculator I use -- it's an Excel spreadsheet file.

Good idea on the digital output -- I'll have to look into that ;)

[Shizuma]

hey jlitman, sorry to hear about your engine...good luck on the build

[jlitman]

hey jlitman, sorry to hear about your engine...good luck on the build

Thanks, man -- guess even when you play w fire carefully, it's still fire... :hide:

**UPDATE!!**

Just placed my order with MWR -- great guys to talk to :thumbup:

Here's what I'm getting:

1. Bareblock with Darton sleeves (core charge is a butt injuring $700 :AF:)

2. Mahle 9:1 CR pistons!

If you are wondering how that happened, they said they didn't have a set of Wisecos for a non-stroker engine on hand, so the Mahles were the only other option.

I'm happy, as it seems to be the superior design and also a slightly higher CR ;)

MWR reccomended strongly against going higher, and also mentioned that it would be a loooong wait, so fvck it -- Mahles it is :)

Now what's this I hear about a 255 lh fuel pump needing a return line? :confused:
Is this covered in the recent install thread? I had no idea...

[22xy]

Now what's this I hear about a 255 lh fuel pump needing a return line? :confused:
Is this covered in the recent install thread? I had no idea...

For your power level/fuel needs the stock system should be okay. It starts choking at 327whp with the stock pump and 630cc injectors (from my own experience), and somewhere above 350whp with the walboro pump. The walboro pump is basically a drop in affair besides a little wiring work.

[the ronin]

There maybe a few revs left in the blower or maybe I'll stop? Jilt I keep hearing fuel pump talk but If you look at my A/F on the video a fifth gear pull to redline all looks pretty good to me with 550cc injectors ? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8960364582116869215

[jlitman]

Now what's this I hear about a 255 lh fuel pump needing a return line? :confused:
Is this covered in the recent install thread? I had no idea...

For your power level/fuel needs the stock system should be okay. It starts choking at 327whp with the stock pump and 630cc injectors (from my own experience), and somewhere above 350whp with the walboro pump. The walboro pump is basically a drop in affair besides a little wiring work.
Okay -- thanks for clarifying. I was pretty baffled by that as no one else here had mentioned the need for a return line.

Any thoughts on which is the better option, Walboro or MWR -- or are they the same thing?

There maybe a few revs left in the blower or maybe I'll stop? Jilt I keep hearing fuel pump talk but If you look at my A/F on the video a fifth gear pull to redline all looks pretty good to me with 550cc injectors ? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8960364582116869215

There's definitely a few revs left to be had -- whether the blower will flow more though remains to be seen... I uploaded the pulley calculator to moremoneky http://www.monkeytuner.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=13879#13879

I guess I'll just upgrade my injectors first and then see whether or not I need the fuel pump. Allegedly, fuel pressure drops off to around 37 psi in boost with the stock pump, whereas the MWR 255lph pump keeps pressure around 49 psi. See here http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?t=190656&highlight=fuel+pump

[22xy]

Any thoughts on which is the better option, Walboro or MWR -- or are they the same thing?


They are the same thing. You can get the walboro pump anywhere, not just from MWR.

[lowredcruzr]

**** it all go rwd and put a big motor in it lol (inside joke)

[jlitman]

**** it all go rwd and put a big motor in it lol (inside joke)

Have you read this heeee-larious thread from the beginning? I think a few folks missed the part where I said my engine needed to be repaired and this wasn't just me throwing a bag of money down the well for the hell of it.

And even if it was, clearly I have an unlimited budget. I make a fortune selling moonshine from my backyard still :gap:

On a semi serious note -- Justin, how much weight could you and your blowtorch shed off of my car without it collapsing in on itself? Let's gut the fvcking thing while the engine is out :D

[Gravel]

On a semi serious note -- Justin, how much weight could you and your blowtorch shed off of my car without it collapsing in on itself? Let's gut the fvcking thing while the engine is out :D

Once you start with weight reduction, where will it end? You have an auto, so you don't actually need your 'clutch-pedal' leg ;)

[drewd]

On a semi serious note -- Justin, how much weight could you and your blowtorch shed off of my car without it collapsing in on itself? Let's gut the fvcking thing while the engine is out :D


I have a feeling I should do this now.

*Takes back opinion about AT F/I GT-S*

:chuckles:

[jlitman]

On a semi serious note -- Justin, how much weight could you and your blowtorch shed off of my car without it collapsing in on itself? Let's gut the fvcking thing while the engine is out :D

Once you start with weight reduction, where will it end? You have an auto, so you don't actually need your 'clutch-pedal' leg ;)

I could saw off my leg and mount a rifle to the stump like Rose McGowan in Grindhouse. That would save weight AND be functional too. Yeehaw!:gap:


On a semi serious note -- Justin, how much weight could you and your blowtorch shed off of my car without it collapsing in on itself? Let's gut the fvcking thing while the engine is out :D


I have a feeling I should do this now.

*Takes back opinion about AT F/I GT-S*

:chuckles:

Heh. Well, look how much we've all learned about FI, emanage & camcon tuning, and water methanol injection from me squandering my money making my slow car a little faster -- why, I'm practically a hero :chuckles:

[Shizuma]

...while the engine's out, look into stitch welding some of the metal together (specifically around the strut towers and radiator)...and if you're up for it, get rid of your moonroof crap

[wts]

I have 4 injectors, and each flows a maximum of 1 gallon/hour or 76 CC/min. It's a progressive controller, so it will flow less than that at spray onset.

My only concern is that I no longer have my water injection come on below 4 psi... So long as I can tune the safe injection system to only be activated at a specified RPM, then I should be fine.

I have an opportunity to pick one up really cheap, but if I can't control when it activates, it'll force me to begin spraying at 1 psi if I want to use it...

4 x76 = 304/cc/min so that s/b OK even if 50% is 152 cc/mm.

Mine's progressive relative to boost as well. Pump DC is 10-15% starting at 4-5psi ramping up to 100% by 10psi. I'll have to install the 225cc/min nozzle in the next incarnation because the 175 wont support 300whp.

The SI-05 has a an adjustable delay ranging from 0 to .6 second.I believe mine's set right in the middle.

[lowredcruzr]

prob a good 100 pounds or so. and still make it look good :)

[GTsRasta]

There goes the FT-HS money :chuckles: good luck man! What made you want to keep pushing instead of finding a new block for cheap and staying conservative?

Oh and BTW I chilled with matadorgts most of last night. He's a whiz at the greddy s/c and the emanage now thanks to you!

[jlitman]

...while the engine's out, look into stitch welding some of the metal together (specifically around the strut towers and radiator)...and if you're up for it, get rid of your moonroof crap
Aw, but I just bought a new moonroof... :sadpace:
prob a good 100 pounds or so. and still make it look good :)
For real? I'll give you a call about this -- depending on what's involved, I may actually want to do some of this :)


There goes the FT-HS money :chuckles: good luck man! What made you want to keep pushing instead of finding a new block for cheap and staying conservative?

Oh and BTW I chilled with matadorgts most of last night. He's a whiz at the greddy s/c and the emanage now thanks to you!

My attempt to secure a usable block fell through, so now it's sleeved+mahle's FTW (see post #81 (http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3700418&postcount=81)). Should have it in 3-4 weeks, if MWR is telling the truth... I'll still be able to buy the FT-HS, I might just have to wait another year after it's released (probably a smart move anyway).

This is definitely it though. I am DONE modding after this last round of repair. From here on out, money will only be spent if something breaks (fingers crossed, it won't, tho').

If something does break, the LEAST expensive/complicated repair is what I'll do. As in, god forbid my tranny every breaks, I'm not doing a swap, I'm just bolting another auto trans on and calling good. If my shocks blow, I'm not buying coilovers, I'm just replacing what I have, etc...

The only exception might be if the S/C ever breaks, I might consider a turbo, but probably I'd just replace the S/C, as that would still be cheaper.

Ugh... never mind I don't want to think about anything else breaking... :scared:

Glad to be of service regaridng tuning ;) I have some new tips on emanage tuning posted in my "suggestions" thread, he might want to check out too.

[jlitman]

I have 4 injectors, and each flows a maximum of 1 gallon/hour or 76 CC/min. It's a progressive controller, so it will flow less than that at spray onset.

My only concern is that I no longer have my water injection come on below 4 psi... So long as I can tune the safe injection system to only be activated at a specified RPM, then I should be fine.

I have an opportunity to pick one up really cheap, but if I can't control when it activates, it'll force me to begin spraying at 1 psi if I want to use it...

4 x76 = 304/cc/min so that s/b OK even if 50% is 152 cc/mm.

Mine's progressive relative to boost as well. Pump DC is 10-15% starting at 4-5psi ramping up to 100% by 10psi. I'll have to install the 225cc/min nozzle in the next incarnation because the 175 wont support 300whp.

The SI-05 has a an adjustable delay ranging from 0 to .6 second.I believe mine's set right in the middle.

Cool -- I should be able to use this with my set up then ;)

[GTsRasta]

Aw, but I just bought a new moonroof... :sadpace:

For real? I'll give you a call about this -- depending on what's involved, I may actually want to do some of this :)



My attempt to secure a usable block fell through, so now it's sleeved+mahle's FTW (see post #81 (http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3700418&postcount=81)). Should have it in 3-4 weeks, if MWR is telling the truth... I'll still be able to buy the FT-HS, I might just have to wait another year after it's released (probably a smart move anyway).

This is definitely it though. I am DONE modding after this last round of repair. From here on out, money will only be spent if something breaks (fingers crossed, it won't, tho').

If something does break, the LEAST expensive/complicated repair is what I'll do. As in, god forbid my tranny every breaks, I'm not doing a swap, I'm just bolting another auto trans on and calling good. If my shocks blow, I'm not buying coilovers, I'm just replacing what I have, etc...

The only exception might be if the S/C ever breaks, I might consider a turbo, but probably I'd just replace the S/C, as that would still be cheaper.

Ugh... never mind I don't want to think about anything else breaking... :scared:

Glad to be of service regaridng tuning ;) I have some new tips on emanage tuning posted in my "suggestions" thread, he might want to check out too.

Cool. You might want to look into valves, springs, bearings, and the oil pump gear to rev higher. I bet much power is hidden in higher revs.

[jlitman]

Aw, but I just bought a new moonroof... :sadpace:

For real? I'll give you a call about this -- depending on what's involved, I may actually want to do some of this :)



My attempt to secure a usable block fell through, so now it's sleeved+mahle's FTW (see post #81 (http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3700418&postcount=81)). Should have it in 3-4 weeks, if MWR is telling the truth... I'll still be able to buy the FT-HS, I might just have to wait another year after it's released (probably a smart move anyway).

This is definitely it though. I am DONE modding after this last round of repair. From here on out, money will only be spent if something breaks (fingers crossed, it won't, tho').

If something does break, the LEAST expensive/complicated repair is what I'll do. As in, god forbid my tranny every breaks, I'm not doing a swap, I'm just bolting another auto trans on and calling good. If my shocks blow, I'm not buying coilovers, I'm just replacing what I have, etc...

The only exception might be if the S/C ever breaks, I might consider a turbo, but probably I'd just replace the S/C, as that would still be cheaper.

Ugh... never mind I don't want to think about anything else breaking... :scared:

Glad to be of service regaridng tuning ;) I have some new tips on emanage tuning posted in my "suggestions" thread, he might want to check out too.

Cool. You might want to look into valves, springs, bearings, and the oil pump gear to rev higher. I bet much power is hidden in higher revs.

Ehh... god forbid a valve is bent, I'd get upgraded parts, but right now I'm still inclined to just not rev as high. I probably won't rev over 8.5K after I put on the new pulley for fear of shortening the blower's lifespan.

With this last pulley (2.875"), I've about hit the limit of the blower. It might be possible to go a little smaller (like a 10th of an inch...), but I don't think it's worth it, The blower will be spinning almost 14.8K at 8.5K engine RPM now.

There maybe a few revs left in the blower or maybe I'll stop?
Frank, what's the highest RPM you rev the engine to? Our pulleys are about the same size, so your limit should be fine for me too.

[22xy]

The only exception might be if the S/C ever breaks, I might consider a turbo, but probably I'd just replace the S/C, as that would still be cheaper.

Actually if the Supercharger goes on you contact WEB 3.0 over at Spyderchat. 313whp on a Rotrex system for the 2zz. :) Really nice torque curve too.

[GTsRasta]

400 hp RWD FT-HS > 313 whp Rotrex S/C FWD Celica (which would be even less with the Automatic transmission)

Find the limits, and then make your way back down to a conservative power level. It would suck if something happened again after pushing it.

[jlitman]

400 hp RWD FT-HS > 313 whp Rotrex S/C FWD Celica (which would be even less with the Automatic transmission)

Find the limits, and then make your way back down to a conservative power level. It would suck if something happened again after pushing it.

Actually, the difference in drive train loss is only about 10% between transmissions, so it would still be up around 280-290 wheel, probably have better traction, and would build boost between shifts... as Boosted once said, "Turbos love autos"...

But guys, guys ... seriously, less speculating on new parts for my experimental grocery-getter, and more praying nothing else will break after this :chuckles:

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

Actually if the Supercharger goes on you contact WEB 3.0 over at Spyderchat. 313whp on a Rotrex system for the 2zz. :) Really nice torque curve too.
I'm not very impressed by the system. Yeah, you get power, but majority (and I mean majority) of that power was created at the high end of the powerband. I want to get something where I get more power in the low-end of the band because that's where I'm gonna drive most of the time.

[jlitman]

Actually if the Supercharger goes on you contact WEB 3.0 over at Spyderchat. 313whp on a Rotrex system for the 2zz. :) Really nice torque curve too.
I'm not very impressed by the system. Yeah, you get power, but majority (and I mean majority) of that power was created at the high end of the powerband. I want to get something where I get more power in the low-end of the band because that's where I'm gonna drive most of the time.

What's the torque curve like? On the MP62 it's pretty flat. You make close to peak torque at 3000 RPM.

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

What's the torque curve like? On the MP62 it's pretty flat. You make close to peak torque at 3000 RPM.
Is it really? I don't remember the torque curve, I think it topped out higher than 3K.

I'll go find that dyno somewhere....

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

Here, found it. It too is a little flat, but it's not topping out at 3K... more of 5K before it drops down again, but it's a gradual rise. Minimum torque is relatively high though... didn't realize that earlier. However, I'm probably gonna shift at what, 3K-4K RPM, unless I feel like gunning it, which is a doubt. It's looking at like approx 150lb-ft torque @ 3.7K and about 107HP @ 3.7K. That's a nice sounding shift point. Hey, not bad.

http://carpron.com/multisite/d/128922-1/dyno_030307.jpg

EDIT: Damnit, that's a 1ZZ. I'll find the 2ZZ dyno. No wonder peak HP was at 235.

[jlitman]

Even on the 1ZZ, that's pretty flat -- looks like it just makes more torque. Must take less power to spin the blower.

[wtcnbrwndo4u]

This is still a 1ZZ dyno, can't find the 2ZZ dyno WEB3.0 made on SpyderChat.
http://www.xtendednet.com/spyder/rotrex_85mm.jpg
Regardless, just imagine the HP up about 20. Still a pretty damn good torque curve. This one isn't as flat though...

EDIT: 2ish PSI at 2,500 rpm to 12.5 PSI at 6800 rpm. That's what this was tuned at. You could probably bump that up a bit on the 2ZZ.

[the ronin]

Yo Jilt I thought you were wanting to keep this about your engine build, wass up ?

[jlitman]

Yo Jilt I thought you were wanting to keep this about your engine build, wass up ?

The thread has a life of its own -- what can ya do? :shrugs:

Say, while you're here -- what's the highest RPM that you rev the engine to? I'm going to call Magnusson and confirm that 16K is the blower's redline. It would suck if it's really 15K...

[the ronin]

I try to keep it a safe max of 8,500 rpm....

[jlitman]

I try to keep it a safe max of 8,500 rpm....

That puts you less than 100 RPMs from 15K -- I'll give magnusson a ring tomorrow.

[jlitman]

Speaking of wandering topics -- everybody interested in the MP62 and FI in general, read this! Chock full of interesting and highly relevant info!

http://www.hiperformancestore.com/superchargerkit.htm

[Gravel]

Speaking of wandering topics -- everybody interested in the MP62 and FI in general, read this! Chock full of interesting and highly relevant info!

http://www.hiperformancestore.com/superchargerkit.htm

Nice link jiltman - so when are you getting your MP62 X-rated? :naughty:

One other thing - where are you measuring your pulley diameters from - the physical diameter of the pulley-rim, or the actual land/groove diameter?

[jlitman]

Speaking of wandering topics -- everybody interested in the MP62 and FI in general, read this! Chock full of interesting and highly relevant info!

http://www.hiperformancestore.com/superchargerkit.htm

Nice link jiltman - so when are you getting your MP62 X-rated? :naughty:

One other thing - where are you measuring your pulley diameters from - the physical diameter of the pulley-rim, or the actual land/groove diameter?

Ha ha ha -- my car should be rated XXX, dirty little whore that she is, taking all my money and providing me a few cheap thrills in return :chuckles:

I measure from rim to rim (hey, that sounds pretty dirty too). Is that not correct? :shrugs:

[Gravel]

Ha ha ha -- my car should be rated XXX, dirty little whore that she is, taking all my money and providing me a few cheap thrills in return :chuckles:

I measure from rim to rim (hey, that sounds pretty dirty too). Is that not correct? :shrugs:

Well, just remember to keep her well lubed once she's back on the job ;)

I don't think the pulley rim is necessarily correct - there's nothing stopping you putting on 3" extra rim on the pulley - it wouldn't change the the belt wrap or blower speed...

As far as I understand it, the diameter 'seen' by the belt is something like the diameter at the middle of the belt - roughly pulley land-diameter + 1/2 belt thickness (not including the groove depth) - this is probably very,very close to what you get by measuring the pulley flange, but as you are desperate to get the max rpm out of your MP62, you don't want to be killed by a measurement error...

Edit: - actually it's the diameter of the circle travelled by the re-enforcing cords in the belt - pretty hard to measure!

[jlitman]

Ha ha ha -- my car should be rated XXX, dirty little whore that she is, taking all my money and providing me a few cheap thrills in return :chuckles:

I measure from rim to rim (hey, that sounds pretty dirty too). Is that not correct? :shrugs:

Well, just remember to keep her well lubed once she's back on the job ;)

I don't think the pulley rim is necessarily correct - there's nothing stopping you putting on 3" extra rim on the pulley - it wouldn't change the the belt wrap or blower speed...

As far as I understand it, the diameter 'seen' by the belt is something like the diameter at the middle of the belt - roughly pulley land-diameter + 1/2 belt thickness (not including the groove depth) - this is probably very,very close to what you get by measuring the pulley flange, but as you are desperate to get the max rpm out of your MP62, you don't want to be killed by a measurement error...

Edit: - actually it's the diameter of the circle travelled by the re-enforcing cords in the belt - pretty hard to measure!

Hey, speaking of being well lubed, I just spent an hour wrestling my wiper motor off (slicing the sh!t out of my hand in the process) and then mysteriously fvcked up my hatch lock (now fixed) and I haven't gotten any sleep yet... so this is a disclaimer for my inability to fully grasp the proper method of measuring pulleys.

That said... the rim extends .125" from the grooves so my pulley is actually 2.75"... I think. No -- wait -- that would be 2.625", Oh hell, I don't know... :confused:

[22xy]

2zz Rotrex:

http://www.xtendednet.com/spyder/Rotrex_2zz_dyno.jpg

[jlitman]

^^^ Holy sh!t! Is that the infamous WEB3.0 blower?

[22xy]

Yes. Compared to the roots dynos I've seen it doesn't look that bad as far as the power down low.

[Gravel]

Hey, speaking of being well lubed, I just spent an hour wrestling my wiper motor off (slicing the sh!t out of my hand in the process) and then mysteriously fvcked up my hatch lock (now fixed) and I haven't gotten any sleep yet... so this is a disclaimer for my inability to fully grasp the proper method of measuring pulleys.

That said... the rim extends .125" from the grooves so my pulley is actually 2.75"... I think. No -- wait -- that would be 2.625", Oh hell, I don't know... :confused:

Ouch - sounds painful!

If you can't accurately measure the diameter, you might need to fit some sort of tachograph and actually measure the s/c rpm directly - or just stay well away (10%+) from its redline!

[jlitman]

Hey, speaking of being well lubed, I just spent an hour wrestling my wiper motor off (slicing the sh!t out of my hand in the process) and then mysteriously fvcked up my hatch lock (now fixed) and I haven't gotten any sleep yet... so this is a disclaimer for my inability to fully grasp the proper method of measuring pulleys.

That said... the rim extends .125" from the grooves so my pulley is actually 2.75"... I think. No -- wait -- that would be 2.625", Oh hell, I don't know... :confused:

Ouch - sounds painful!

If you can't accurately measure the diameter, you might need to fit some sort of tachograph and actually measure the s/c rpm directly - or just stay well away (10%+) from its redline!

Four hrs of sleep, and I am refreshed! (Well, sorta).

Nah, for the smaller of the two guesstimates, I'm a good 1K away at 8K and at the limit at 8.4K. If Frank's hasn't exploeded yet, I should be fine :)

[Gravel]

Four hrs of sleep, and I am refreshed! (Well, sorta).

Nah, for the smaller of the two guesstimates, I'm a good 1K away at 8K and at the limit at 8.4K. If Frank's hasn't exploeded yet, I should be fine :)

Yep, you're probably fine - but then again, what did you say about your boost on a stock engine? :hide:

How much are a pair of Kevlar boxer shorts these days? ;)

[jlitman]

Four hrs of sleep, and I am refreshed! (Well, sorta).

Nah, for the smaller of the two guesstimates, I'm a good 1K away at 8K and at the limit at 8.4K. If Frank's hasn't exploeded yet, I should be fine :)

Yep, you're probably fine - but then again, what did you say about your boost on a stock engine? :hide:

How much are a pair of Kevlar boxer shorts these days? ;)

From now on I'll just say "If Frank's _____ hasn't exploded, my ______ should be fine too." :chuckles:

Alas, "stock engine" won't fit in those blanks. So far, "S/C" does.

Fingers, as always, are crossed :D

[the ronin]

Hey pizza face.....I'm gonna order up another pulley and slap in some 650cc's and tweek it one more time and then it's done.......

[imhotep]

Good find on that link Jlitman... so nobody fabricated an intercooler for the mp62 yet? i guess W/I is the best way to go...

[jlitman]

Hey pizza face.....I'm gonna order up another pulley and slap in some 650cc's and tweek it one more time and then it's done.......

What size are you going to? I wouldn't go smaller than 2.7... did you check out the pulley calculator I posted on moremonkey?

Good find on that link Jlitman... so nobody fabricated an intercooler for the mp62 yet? i guess W/I is the best way to go...

Uh... Ronin has an intercooler...

Belated afterthought:
I was a little surprised to read that W/I had a limited effect on cooling relative to it's knock supression properties. I wonder now if, as I suspected, it wasn't knock that damaged my motor, but rather a heat-swollen piston...

If memory serves, when Ronin suffered a similar mishap on the stock motor, the piston and rings were undamaged but the bore was badly scarred.

I will have to play with the mixture once I'm up and running again. I think adding a bit more methanol might improve cooling given that alcohol evaporates much faster than water. What's nice is that I'll be able to emeasure EGT's to better assess the effect of various mixtures.

Sigh. Actually, for a damaged motor, she's still running pretty strong over 2500 RPM. Once yer moving, you'd never know it was a bit gimpy... :sadpace:

[Gravel]

What size are you going to? I wouldn't go smaller than 2.7... did you check out the pulley calculator I posted on moremonkey?


Uh... Ronin has an intercooler...

Belated afterthought:
I was a little surprised to read that W/I had a limited effect on cooling relative to it's knock supression properties. I wonder now if, as I suspected, it wasn't knock that damaged my motor, but rather a heat-swollen piston...

If memory serves, when Ronin suffered a similar mishap on the stock motor, the piston and rings were undamaged but the bore was badly scarred.

I will have to play with the mixture once I'm up and running again. I think adding a bit more methanol might improve cooling given that alcohol evaporates much faster than water. What's nice is that I'll be able to emeasure EGT's to better assess the effect of various mixtures.

Sigh. Actually, for a damaged motor, she's still running pretty strong over 2500 RPM. Once yer moving, you'd never know it was a bit gimpy... :sadpace:


Well, then I guess the question is would Mahle pistons have gouged a clean bore as well? :shrugs: And, I suppose, could hot Wisco's damage iron liners - aluminium expands faster than iron, but I suppose the bores are harder, and so might just 'skimm' the hot pistons :(

I am sure someone will intercool an MP62 on a Celica - it just won't be cost effective, but hey - it's not always about the bottom line :)

[jlitman]

What size are you going to? I wouldn't go smaller than 2.7... did you check out the pulley calculator I posted on moremonkey?


Uh... Ronin has an intercooler...

Belated afterthought:
I was a little surprised to read that W/I had a limited effect on cooling relative to it's knock supression properties. I wonder now if, as I suspected, it wasn't knock that damaged my motor, but rather a heat-swollen piston...

If memory serves, when Ronin suffered a similar mishap on the stock motor, the piston and rings were undamaged but the bore was badly scarred.

I will have to play with the mixture once I'm up and running again. I think adding a bit more methanol might improve cooling given that alcohol evaporates much faster than water. What's nice is that I'll be able to emeasure EGT's to better assess the effect of various mixtures.

Sigh. Actually, for a damaged motor, she's still running pretty strong over 2500 RPM. Once yer moving, you'd never know it was a bit gimpy... :sadpace:


Well, then I guess the question is would Mahle pistons have gouged a clean bore as well? :shrugs: And, I suppose, could hot Wisco's damage iron liners - aluminium expands faster than iron, but I suppose the bores are harder, and so might just 'skimm' the hot pistons :(

I am sure someone will intercool an MP62 on a Celica - it just won't be cost effective, but hey - it's not always about the bottom line :)

No Wisecos for me, remember? ;)

The Mahles, like all forged pistons, so I'm told, are prone to expansion, but they are also machined for improved piston to wall clearance (allegedly). The darton sleeves are supposed to be more wear resistant and, if damaged, can be re-honed. At least these are the rationales that were presented to me back when I thought I might have the luxury of avoiding all this sleeving business. Oh well...

[imhotep]

umm whose ronin? does he have a picture of his intercooled MP62 celica?

[Gravel]

umm whose ronin? does he have a picture of his intercooled MP62 celica?

No, because he has a air-water cooled Lotus ;)

As far as I know, no-one has done an intercooled MP62 on a Celica yet - except perhaps Hotchkis - if indeed it was an MP62 they used on their race car.

[Gravel]

No Wisecos for me, remember? ;)

The Mahles, like all forged pistons, so I'm told, are prone to expansion, but they are also machined for improved piston to wall clearance (allegedly). The darton sleeves are supposed to be more wear resistant and, if damaged, can be re-honed. At least these are the rationales that were presented to me back when I thought I might have the luxury of avoiding all this sleeving business. Oh well...

I'm just trying to get my head around the mechanics of that - I guess the Mahle's are a bit undersize, but still seal tight due to correctly sized rings? :shrugs:

Presumably if you have damaged Darton's, you need oversized pistons to handle the over-bore you had to do to repair them? :shrugs:

I guess since they're all low volume, it is trivial for them to machine you a slightly off size set before the do the final coating.

[the ronin]

Ok the 2.60 is ordered should have it in two weeks......I'm gonna go by the fact that the magnasun has the mp90 bearings and can take a little more speed....who knows?

[jlitman]

Ok the 2.60 is ordered should have it in two weeks......I'm gonna go by the fact that the magnasun has the mp90 bearings and can take a little more speed....who knows?

????? :confused:
Really? Wait, tell me more -- just how fast can it spin before the bearings go or their life is cut drastically short?

For 2.6", you're gonna be over 16K at 8.5 engine RPM...

[the ronin]

I don't know but I'll find out......Lotus sport are running 14.8 psi same size pulley....
hey does this look like Tampa.. :monkey: www.youtube.com/watch?v=Km4IyerZkw8

[GTsRasta]

Nice video!

[jlitman]

I don't know but I'll find out......Lotus sport are running 14.8 psi same size pulley....
No sh!t? Well, if the blower's the same then I guess it's safe -- unless of course they don't care if the S/C gets rebuilt after the race.

Wait -- only 14.8 psi? That's after an intercooler, right?


hey does this look like Tampa.. :monkey: www.youtube.com/watch?v=Km4IyerZkw8
Not enough homeless people or trailer parks to be Tampa. And, Frank you drive like an old woman -- you missed every single bike rider on the road! You've got to try harder, man! :gap:

[GangstaCelicaGT93079]

hey bro this looks interesting with whats going on with your car, where is it at as you know I'm in Tampa and I'd love to stop by to see your ride:) I'm off tues this week, mind if I stop by?

[jlitman]

^^^ The ol' grey mare is limping at the moment... You might as well wait until she's back on her feet and I do another XAT Racing Dyno Day. Probably around August :shrugs:

[GangstaCelicaGT93079]

ok, well can't wait to see:)

[jlitman]

Sort of an update for those who give a sh!t...

New additions to the rebuild line up are:

1. A PPE Race header (assuming the prototype performs as well as expected)

2. A nice port job on the Greddy IM by Boosted2.0

3. Will be going back to higher methanol concentration on the W/I (50-50 or 60-40, yet to be detemined).

Sigh... I wish my sleeved block and pistons would arrive already... :sadpace:

Okay, that's all for now... :sadwave:

[drewd]

^^^ The ol' grey mare is limping at the moment... You might as well wait until she's back on her feet and I do another XAT Racing Dyno Day. Probably around August :shrugs:



Count me in :)

[GTsRasta]

I hope to see "high" hp numbers after this is all done :) . I can imagine how well a MT setup like yours tuned on a standalone will do. I don't think I'll be going as wild as you are when I see about matadorgts's greddy s/c.

[jlitman]

I hope to see "high" hp numbers after this is all done :) . I can imagine how well a MT setup like yours tuned on a standalone will do. I don't think I'll be going as wild as you are when I see about matadorgts's greddy s/c.

If the PPE header pans out, Boosted's porting of the IM works out well, and the new pulley really makes 17 psi as Miles told me, I think something in the 260's or more to the tire is very likely.

[Gravel]

If the PPE header pans out, Boosted's porting of the IM works out well, and the new pulley really makes 17 psi as Miles told me, I think something in the 260's or more to the tire is very likely.

That does sound like a lot of fun - good job there's no 'hooning' laws round your way :)

[jlitman]

If the PPE header pans out, Boosted's porting of the IM works out well, and the new pulley really makes 17 psi as Miles told me, I think something in the 260's or more to the tire is very likely.

That does sound like a lot of fun - good job there's no 'hooning' laws round your way :)

Actually, I sat and recalculated everything, and my estimate is very conservative (don't want to get my hopes too high up -- too many unknown factors yet to be resolved). A less conservative estimate puts it in the 280's :AF:

Well, we'll see... if the race header pans out, I'll have a set up that is very close to Frank's, but with a different trans. I'd say, whatever power level Frank is at, I should be trailing by ~25 whp.

Honestly, if I even see 240-250 I'll be thrilled.

[emotart]

Actually, I sat and recalculated everything, and my estimate is very conservative (don't want to get my hopes too high up -- too many unknown factors yet to be resolved). A less conservative estimate puts it in the 280's :AF:

Well, we'll see... if the race header pans out, I'll have a set up that is very close to Frank's, but with a different trans. I'd say, whatever power level Frank is at, I should be trailing by ~25 whp.

Honestly, if I even see 240-250 I'll be thrilled.

Good to here about another auto, my car should be getting finished up today or tomm.. so we shall see how that goes.

[jlitman]

Actually, I sat and recalculated everything, and my estimate is very conservative (don't want to get my hopes too high up -- too many unknown factors yet to be resolved). A less conservative estimate puts it in the 280's :AF:

Well, we'll see... if the race header pans out, I'll have a set up that is very close to Frank's, but with a different trans. I'd say, whatever power level Frank is at, I should be trailing by ~25 whp.

Honestly, if I even see 240-250 I'll be thrilled.

Good to here about another auto, my car should be getting finished up today or tomm.. so we shall see how that goes.

Whoa -- this is news! Awesome -- keep us posted :thumbup:

[GTsRasta]

Good to here about another auto, my car should be getting finished up today or tomm.. so we shall see how that goes.

I thought your car was a fairy tale man :gap: if it's ready you HAVE to bring it to the seaside meet. It's only two weeks away!

[emotart]

I thought your car was a fairy tale man :gap: if it's ready you HAVE to bring it to the seaside meet. It's only two weeks away!

Thats the plan, finish up the tunning and then ship it back Home.
:gap:

[jlitman]

Congrats! Looking forward to pics, dynos, and details. :D

[drewd]

What's the word on a new XAT Dyno day?
Hopefully I'll have some stage 2 cams installed by then..

[jlitman]

To be honest, I'm not especially motivated to arrange one until after my engine is rebuilt and broken in (selfish Jordan)... someone else could head one up I suppose. Otherwise, I'd say probably sometime in August.

[GTsRasta]

Update? I bet you could see another 5 whp if you switched over and tuned with a Injen CAI :crazy2:

[jlitman]

Update? I bet you could see another 5 whp if you switched over and tuned with a Injen CAI :crazy2:

I'll bet you $3.50 that I don't. I'm thinking 2 whp more at most and I go from 0% chance of hydrolock to a 10% or greater chance (rainy season's a-comin', and my parking lot floods. My luck, I'll hydrolock at home).

I'm expecting good, solid gains with the ported IM and header though :)

As to updates... Want to see pictures of some of my new goodies (injectors, gauges, etc.)? :naughty:

[Gravel]

As to updates... Want to see pictures of some of my new goodies (injectors, gauges, etc.)? :naughty:

Come on Jiltman, you big tease, get 'em out for the lads :)

[GTsRasta]

Haha yea sure, lets see pics of the goods.

I was just enticing you to change it out, I didn't mean it. If I lived in Florida or even New Jersey with a CAI I would never come out when it rains.

[Rombomb420]

I'm stuck with SRI here in the chicago milwaukee area. Anyone with a CAI was asking for it last night....

Where's those pics Jlitman ? :gap:

[jlitman]

Heh heh heh... I'll take some photos later. I actually need to do some work for a change right now.

[GTsRasta]

Hey jlitman...do you mind showing the math of how much you pay for boost juice again? I can't seem to find it in your past threads. I know you broke it down to how much you pay per year and how much extra money you pay per gassing up a full tank.

If everything pans out for me to get the greddy supercharger, I'm considering just getting water injection and a 10 psi pulley since it may work out to be wayyy more efficient towards getting 12's in the quarter mile than running a map for race gas and nitrous, especially since I'll have the power all the time.

Thanks!

[jlitman]

Hey jlitman...do you mind showing the math of how much you pay for boost juice again? I can't seem to find it in your past threads. I know you broke it down to how much you pay per year and how much extra money you pay per gassing up a full tank.

If everything pans out for me to get the greddy supercharger, I'm considering just getting water injection and a 10 psi pulley since it may work out to be wayyy more efficient towards getting 12's in the quarter mile than running a map for race gas and nitrous, especially since I'll have the power all the time.

Thanks!

I gave up on the boost juice and decided to just play alchemist and mix my own. I can get pure methanol at a shop around here for under $5 a gallon. I buy that and distilled water (you MUST use distilled) and just mix it myself ;)

As to 12's.... ehhh, that combo probably won't make enough power for that even if you are amazingly good. You'll maybe be able to hit low to mid-13's.

Aanjae had the S/C and a 25 shot and hit just over EDIT: 13.3 -- another 2 lbs of boost plus W/I will probably not add 25 whp, and even if it does, it won't hit all at once the way it would for N2O.

VladGT-S was making well over 250+/170+ wheel (don't know exactly how much, but he claimed to run more boost than he had dynoed at wehn he was at the track -- so let's guess it was more like 270/185 or so) and he hit just over a 13.2.

Now, you might be a really awesome drag racer, so perhaps you could match or just beat that with less power, but for anything in the 12's you'll probably need much more power and probably slicks.

[Gravel]

:worthless: :D

[GTsRasta]

I gave up on the boost juice and decided to just play alchemist and mix my own. I can get pure methanol at a shop around here for under $5 a gallon. I buy that and distilled water (you MUST use distilled) and just mix it myself ;)

As to 12's.... ehhh, that combo probably won't make enough power for that even if you are amazingly good. You'll maybe be able to hit low to mid-13's.

Aanjae had the S/C and a 25 shot and hit just over 13.9 -- another 2 lbs of boost plus W/I will probably not add 25 whp, and even if it does, it won't hit all at once the way it would for N2O.

VladGT-S was making well over 250+/170+ wheel (don't know exactly how much, but he claimed to run more boost than he had dynoed at wehn he was at the track -- so let's guess it was more like 290/185 or so) and he hit just over a 13.2.

Now, you might be a really awesome drag racer, so perhaps you could match or just beat that with less power, but for anything in the 12's you'll probably need much more power and probably slicks.

Aanjae actually hit around 13.3 in the track time database, take a look ;) . For all others that wonder about his S/C plus nitrous setup, please note that he ran that combo with 104 octane gas. Through many pm's with him recently, he claims that the 13.3 second run he had was destined for 12's if he didn't miss a gear. Plus since a bolt on 03 GTS (I bet starting off with 175+ whp) with a 75 shot (obviously on the stock ECU) can get a 12.8 on slicks, I'm sure 250+ whp would be enough from a greddy charger, 10 psi pulley, and WI.

MWR already eeked out 236 whp from a I/H/E bold on greddy supercharged car with a PFC. Using that map as a basemap would be a very good start for a I/H/E greddy s/c car. I'm sure at least another 5 whp can be picked up from a Injen CAI swap (he had the AEM CAI), PPE/Ported Header swap (he had the Trial header), catback exhaust swap (axleback to RS*R), cat delete, custom mid pipe, and Boosted2.0's polydyn tx7 stuff. As for the other 10+ whp, the extra 2 psi pulley and WI could take care of that based on your results. Although this is clearly ricer math, it's conservative. But it would be completely be dependant on a good PFC tune.

And yes, weight reduction along with drag radials or slicks would be a must. When I'm ready to hit the track, I hope to snatch up someone's stock 15's for dirt cheap and slap on some drag radials. I might be able to get my hands on slicks if the older brother of one of my girlfriend's close friends can hook me up :D . He races NASCAR like tuner cars in local circuits out here in Long Island and had a TON of them in the back of his Chevy Silverado :burnout: .

[the ronin]

Jiltman now I know your gonna hate me for this..........get Smaay's return fuel rail system, trust me on this......

[GTsRasta]

His car pulls like a beast, eh? I saw your little review in his thread, haha.

I like the idea of having fuel evenly distributed through the cylinders, I hope you eek out more power with his fuel rail too ronin.

[22xy]

Jiltman now I know your gonna hate me for this..........get Smaay's return fuel rail system, trust me on this......

It is nice. Drop in and drive. Just be sure to unscrew the pressure regulator out since it is set to ~80psi in the box. Cylinder wash baby!!!

[ahnjae]

I gave up on the boost juice and decided to just play alchemist and mix my own. I can get pure methanol at a shop around here for under $5 a gallon. I buy that and distilled water (you MUST use distilled) and just mix it myself ;)

As to 12's.... ehhh, that combo probably won't make enough power for that even if you are amazingly good. You'll maybe be able to hit low to mid-13's.

Aanjae had the S/C and a 25 shot and hit just over 13.9 -- another 2 lbs of boost plus W/I will probably not add 25 whp, and even if it does, it won't hit all at once the way it would for N2O.

VladGT-S was making well over 250+/170+ wheel (don't know exactly how much, but he claimed to run more boost than he had dynoed at wehn he was at the track -- so let's guess it was more like 290/185 or so) and he hit just over a 13.2.

Now, you might be a really awesome drag racer, so perhaps you could match or just beat that with less power, but for anything in the 12's you'll probably need much more power and probably slicks.

Aanjae actually hit around 13.3 in the track time database, take a look ;) . For all others that wonder about his S/C plus nitrous setup, please note that he ran that combo with 104 octane gas. Through many pm's with him recently, he claims that the 13.3 second run he had was destined for 12's if he didn't miss a gear. Plus since a bolt on 03 GTS (I bet starting off with 175+ whp) with a 75 shot (obviously on the stock ECU) can get a 12.8 on slicks, I'm sure 250+ whp would be enough from a greddy charger, 10 psi pulley, and WI.

MWR already eeked out 236 whp from a I/H/E bold on greddy supercharged car with a PFC. Using that map as a basemap would be a very good start for a I/H/E greddy s/c car. I'm sure at least another 5 whp can be picked up from a Injen CAI swap (he had the AEM CAI), PPE/Ported Header swap (he had the Trial header), catback exhaust swap (axleback to RS*R), cat delete, custom mid pipe, and Boosted2.0's polydyn tx7 stuff. As for the other 10+ whp, the extra 2 psi pulley and WI could take care of that based on your results. Although this is clearly ricer math, it's conservative. But it would be completely be dependant on a good PFC tune.

And yes, weight reduction along with drag radials or slicks would be a must. When I'm ready to hit the track, I hope to snatch up someone's stock 15's for dirt cheap and slap on some drag radials. I might be able to get my hands on slicks if the older brother of one of my girlfriend's close friends can hook me up :D . He races NASCAR like tuner cars in local circuits out here in Long Island and had a TON of them in the back of his Chevy Silverado :burnout: .

yeah i pulled a 13.348 @ 100.08MPH to be exact. My mods were stock greddy pulley(no extra boost), NOS on 104 octane, and of course all the other simple bolt on mods (stock header though and not ported) w/ drag radials. I missed a gear and should have finished in the 12s that run cause usually i trap at about 107 MPH. I didnt list that run in the data base. I have the slip if anyone doesnt believe me. oh and by the way, this was all done on base map that came with the kit.

I just installed a WI kit that injects before the charger and will be tuning for it in next couple of months. I'll let you know how it goes....

[jlitman]

Aanjae actually hit around 13.3 in the track time database, take a look ;) . For all others that wonder about his S/C plus nitrous setup, please note that he ran that combo with 104 octane gas. Through many pm's with him recently, he claims that the 13.3 second run he had was destined for 12's if he didn't miss a gear. Plus since a bolt on 03 GTS (I bet starting off with 175+ whp) with a 75 shot (obviously on the stock ECU) can get a 12.8 on slicks, I'm sure 250+ whp would be enough from a greddy charger, 10 psi pulley, and WI.
I stand corrected on Aanjae's time. Sounds reasonable -- try it and see :)

Jiltman now I know your gonna hate me for this..........get Smaay's return fuel rail system, trust me on this......
I'm gonna see how AFRs and duty cycle are after the new injectors and Walboro pump and then take it from there.

:worthless: :D
Nag, nag, nag :gap:

I'll post these tonight for sure -- although, they're really not that exciting :)

[jlitman]

Okay, these aren't very exciting items, but it's all I've got at the moment...

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/New_goodies.jpg

Autometer intake air-temp gauge (may not be able to use, in which case will be selling)

Sard 530cc 4-hole injectors

New itty-bitty pulley (should make ~17 psi)

Prosport EGT gauge

Autometer AT temp gauge

IK27 plugs

I also have a few other odds and ends (gaskets, gauge pods, etc.)

Still waiting on the block and pistons :sadpace:

[GSBoek]

Pulley looks sexy. I happen to love polished metal.

[Celicahzn]

Yep. I've worked out the calculations, and it comes out to be about a 4-6% reduction in power output. See this post for details and relevant links http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3677764&postcount=90

Basically, I'd need at least another 2 psi to make up the difference. As luck would have it, I have a pulley on hand that should make 4 to 5 more psi than my current one :gap:

sounds about right but man the power loss is a killer for you and good luck.

[jlitman]

Yep. I've worked out the calculations, and it comes out to be about a 4-6% reduction in power output. See this post for details and relevant links http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3677764&postcount=90

Basically, I'd need at least another 2 psi to make up the difference. As luck would have it, I have a pulley on hand that should make 4 to 5 more psi than my current one :gap:

sounds about right but man the power loss is a killer for you and good luck.

Nah, not really. I'll still probably see 250 - 280 wheel if my header project pans out.

[Celicahzn]

Nah, not really. I'll still probably see 250 - 280 wheel if my header project pans out.

haha i was just gonna say that and with a nice set of piper stage 3 your gonna be around 300whp i am also looking for to your header plan as well. awesome job getting it together jlit.

[jlitman]

Nah, not really. I'll still probably see 250 - 280 wheel if my header project pans out.

haha i was just gonna say that and with a nice set of piper stage 3 your gonna be around 300whp i am also looking for to your header plan as well. awesome job getting it together jlit.

Thanks :D

Truthfully, I think my engine was always a bit gimpy (even for an auto) when stock, so it will be interesting to see how it runs once rebuilt and broken in.

Which remind me -- I need to call MWR and see what's the hold up with my block!

[Celicahzn]

awesome keep us posted and is it gonna go transformer ahah. just saw the movie it was great. the megan chick is ****en hot . oh man and the new camaro is hot. might see and asian guy with a camaro now ahha.

Thanks :D

Truthfully, I think my engine was always a bit gimpy (even for an auto) when stock, so it will be interesting to see how it runs once rebuilt and broken in.

Which remind me -- I need to call MWR and see what's the hold up with my block!

[GTsRasta]

Hey Jlitman, I think you should add some paddle shifters to make your gutted car an even better looking track toy. :gap:

http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3751095&posted=1#post3751095

And here's a nice pic from one of his reader's ride threads:

http://alex.autofxgarage.com/NC%20photos/CIMG5801.jpg

[jlitman]

^^^ I've thought about it, but it's expensive (~$800) and I'd only do it if I also upgraded the valve body to get more of a performance benefit from it (~$500 + labor and down time).

Also, I kind of like having an airbag :)

[Arctic-GTS]

^^^ I've thought about it, but it's expensive (~$800) and I'd only do it if I also upgraded the valve body to get more of a preformance benefit from it (~$500 + labor and down time).

Also, I kind of like having an airbag :)

PFF... Airbags... Seatbelts... Safety... Overrated.

[GTsRasta]

Also, I kind of like having an airbag :)

P*ssy :chuckles: j/k.

This paddle shifter plus a beefed up Matrix AWD tranny would make your car complete IMO. I'd go through with it if I had a auto GTS and I found a AWD tranny for cheap from a junk yard or something. If MWR will make 600+ hp on "weak" 2zz A/T transmission, I'm sure something can be done to beef up the Matrix AWD tranny.

Keep us updated!

[jlitman]

Also, I kind of like having an airbag :)

P*ssy :chuckles: j/k.

This paddle shifter plus a beefed up Matrix AWD tranny would make your car complete IMO. I'd go through with it if I had a auto GTS and I found a AWD tranny for cheap from a junk yard or something. If MWR will make 600+ hp on "weak" 2zz A/T transmission, I'm sure something can be done to beef up the Matrix AWD tranny.

Keep us updated!

Putting my head into a windshield once was enough. Got blood all over my favorite shirt (damn scalp wounds).

I like the sound of all of that, but it's just too expensive to contemplate at the moment. Maybe something for down the road :shrugs:

[jlitman]

Just spoke with MWR -- my block is at the machine shop, and they expect to have it back this week. So with a little bit of luck, I should have it by sometime next week! :applaud:

Better call my buddy who's doing the rebuild for me and make sure he's prepared... I'll be borrowing his MR2 while he works on my car :D

Soon... soon... :wtc:

[GTsRasta]

Nice.

And I'm sorry to hear about your past accident. I've seen a couple bad ones myself, it ain't pretty.

[jlitman]

Nice.

And I'm sorry to hear about your past accident. I've seen a couple bad ones myself, it ain't pretty.

At least I learned my skull > windshield. :gap: I spiderwebbed the glass but just had a small cut on my scalp -- they bleed like crazy, tho'. I wasn't even wearing my seatbelt (now I do). It was a head on collision and I was the passenger -- happened years ago; I was just graduating HS.

[Gravel]

At least I learned my skull > windshield. :gap: I spiderwebbed the glass but just had a small cut on my scalp -- they bleed like crazy, tho'. I wasn't even wearing my seatbelt (now I do). It was a head on collision and I was the passenger -- happened years ago; I was just graduating HS.

Ouch - that's what you get for not wearing your belt, you dumbass - glad you're boneheaded enough to still be with us though :)

IMHO I'd much rather have a decent 4-point harness and a roll-cage than an airbag - if there was no way that my head could hit the wheel at all, I wouldn't need an explosive charge inches away from both my face and my balls to 'protect' me!

I saw a rally car hit a tree head on at 120MPH in the WRC - engine was 20 feet from the car, and the rest of it was scattered across the track. The passenger cell was intact though, one driver had a broken rib, the other a few cuts and grazes - how many air bags did they have - exactly none ;)

Anyway, rant over - nice looking parts Jiltman - what's the ETA on your block then - or is that a painful question?

[jlitman]

At least I learned my skull > windshield. :gap: I spiderwebbed the glass but just had a small cut on my scalp -- they bleed like crazy, tho'. I wasn't even wearing my seatbelt (now I do). It was a head on collision and I was the passenger -- happened years ago; I was just graduating HS.

Ouch - that's what you get for not wearing your belt, you dumbass - glad you're boneheaded enough to still be with us though :)

IMHO I'd much rather have a decent 4-point harness and a roll-cage than an airbag - if there was no way that my head could hit the wheel at all, I wouldn't need an explosive charge inches away from both my face and my balls to 'protect' me!

I saw a rally car hit a tree head on at 120MPH in the WRC - engine was 20 feet from the car, and the rest of it was scattered across the track. The passenger cell was intact though, one driver had a broken rib, the other a few cuts and grazes - how many air bags did they have - exactly none ;)

Anyway, rant over - nice looking parts Jiltman - what's the ETA on your block then - or is that a painful question?

Hey there! :wave:

Oh, I learned my lesson after that. I always wear my seatbelt now. It was my friends Mercury hatchback vs. Some old gent in a big Buick. The Buick won that round of battle, and suffered only a broken grill; my friend's car was totaled. I recall hitting on one of the nurses while at the hospital, strapped to a board with a head and neck brace on. Ah, memories.

Anyway, according to MWR I'll have it by sometime next week (not holding my breath, tho').

They told me their machinist had a HEART ATTACK, and this slowed work down at the shop! :AF:

At the risk of sounding callous, I just hope my engine was properly sleeved...

[jlitman]

Okay, I'm not gonna lie: This is not an update, this is me expressing concern.

Got a message from MWR today to the effect of "Hey, man we really need to talk -- give us a call back." :wtf:

I got the message after 6 PM on Friday, so odds are I won't know if that is indicative of bad news or what before Monday at the earliest... :eek:

Why oh why don't people leave detailed messages when they let you know they need to tell you something? (Knowing now > Finding out later :faint: ).

I don't need to be told "in person", I just need to know. A lengthy voice mail message will do the job.

Sigh.

That is all. :sadpace:

[GTsRasta]

Lame. I hope everything gets sorted out man. Sorry to hear.

Good luck!

[the ronin]

At least you didn't put your car on the dyno and bend every valve when it hit lift...Selling Mahle 8.8 pistons without the proper valve clearance is bull ****e.....I had to tear it out and pay for the R$R and rebuild all over again......then they passed the buck...anytime MWR want to chime in feel free.....

[Exotic II]

I gave up on the boost juice and decided to just play alchemist and mix my own. I can get pure methanol at a shop around here for under $5 a gallon. I buy that and distilled water (you MUST use distilled) and just mix it myself ;)

As to 12's.... ehhh, that combo probably won't make enough power for that even if you are amazingly good. You'll maybe be able to hit low to mid-13's.

Aanjae had the S/C and a 25 shot and hit just over EDIT: 13.3 -- another 2 lbs of boost plus W/I will probably not add 25 whp, and even if it does, it won't hit all at once the way it would for N2O.

VladGT-S was making well over 250+/170+ wheel (don't know exactly how much, but he claimed to run more boost than he had dynoed at wehn he was at the track -- so let's guess it was more like 270/185 or so) and he hit just over a 13.2.

Now, you might be a really awesome drag racer, so perhaps you could match or just beat that with less power, but for anything in the 12's you'll probably need much more power and probably slicks.


Uh .... I'm running 12's on 11 lbs.

[jlitman]

I gave up on the boost juice and decided to just play alchemist and mix my own. I can get pure methanol at a shop around here for under $5 a gallon. I buy that and distilled water (you MUST use distilled) and just mix it myself ;)

As to 12's.... ehhh, that combo probably won't make enough power for that even if you are amazingly good. You'll maybe be able to hit low to mid-13's.

Aanjae had the S/C and a 25 shot and hit just over EDIT: 13.3 -- another 2 lbs of boost plus W/I will probably not add 25 whp, and even if it does, it won't hit all at once the way it would for N2O.

VladGT-S was making well over 250+/170+ wheel (don't know exactly how much, but he claimed to run more boost than he had dynoed at wehn he was at the track -- so let's guess it was more like 270/185 or so) and he hit just over a 13.2.

Now, you might be a really awesome drag racer, so perhaps you could match or just beat that with less power, but for anything in the 12's you'll probably need much more power and probably slicks.


Uh .... I'm running 12's on 11 lbs.

Actually, with a 3" pulley, I'm surprised you're not pushing closer to 13 psi. If you're making significantly less power than I expected as necessary for that low a time either (a) You are an awesome drag racer or (b) I'm wrong, and stand corrected.

That pre-compression mix is definitely doing some good things for your torque band (although I'm still worried about eventual rotor delamination) -- did you ever get a new dyno? I'd love to see what you are putting down now!

I'm also getting more interested in tuning by MAP -- how's it idle and run off idle? Is it smoother for around town driving?

At least you didn't put your car on the dyno and bend every valve when it hit lift...Selling Mahle 8.8 pistons without the proper valve clearance is bull ****e.....I had to tear it out and pay for the R$R and rebuild all over again......then they passed the buck...anytime MWR want to chime in feel free.....

Urgh -- yeah I remember reading aout that. Not a good day...

I asked MWR about the valve clearance and they assured me these pistons were the correct specs, so in theory that isn't the problem. I have a bad feeling it's more that their original "3-5" week wait is about to be doubled due to slow down at the machine shop :faint:

[GTsRasta]

Uh .... I'm running 12's on 11 lbs.

Did you run 12's with just the WI added on, or with WI + nitrous? Your PM box is full, and I've been dying to ask you this question for about a week now.

[ahnjae]

Uh .... I'm running 12's on 11 lbs.

Did you run 12's with just the WI added on, or with WI + nitrous? Your PM box is full, and I've been dying to ask you this question for about a week now.

my question is how did you run a 1.9 60ft. on street tires wrapped around 18" wheels? :wtf: Most people that go to the tracks like myself know this is unheard of! Majority of people are using drag radials to get 2.0 60fts at best. You are getting times that slicks would get you. And also these guys are using 15" wheels while your on 18s? It doesnt make sense. But hey if you did, then more power to you. You will be the first ive ever heard of running a 1.9 60ft on 18" street tires then.

[Exotic II]

^ I have an extra set of 18" rims with preped Hankook Ventus Z212 that are soaked and super sticky. With less than 2/32 tread.

[jlitman]

^ I have an extra set of 18" rims with preped Hankook Ventus Z212 that are soaked and super sticky. With less than 2/32 tread.

I've come to the conclusion that other than dirver skill a lot of getting good times is due to smart prepping! I can't wait to see how my slow auto does at the track when the build and tuning are done. :gap:

Speaking of which -- my engine block is finally on its way!!! :applaud:

The news they had for me was: They said they had the block sitting there for 2 weeks, but didn't have my phone number!?!? :wtf:

They called to tell me they didn't have my phone number? :wtf:

They claim they had the block for two weeks -- I called to find out about the machinist around then!?

Huh??!?!?!?! :faint:

Whatever -- at least now its on its way :D

[Exotic II]

^ Good deal. Can't wait to see the final product.

[GTsRasta]

^ I have an extra set of 18" rims with preped Hankook Ventus Z212 that are soaked and super sticky. With less than 2/32 tread.

So I assume you made it into the high-mid 12's without nitrous on that run...cool. (Feel free to correct me if I am wrong...)

I've come to the conclusion that other than dirver skill a lot of getting good times is due to smart prepping! I can't wait to see how my slow auto does at the track when the build and tuning are done. :gap:

Speaking of which -- my engine block is finally on its way!!! :applaud:

The news they had for me was: They said they had the block sitting there for 2 weeks, but didn't have my phone number!?!? :wtf:

They called to tell me they didn't have my phone number? :wtf:

They claim they had the block for two weeks -- I called to find out about the machinist around then!?

Huh??!?!?!?! :faint:

Whatever -- at least now its on its way :D

AWESOME!

[jlitman]

I should have the block and pistons by then end of the week. The build should start next week and will hopefully be wrapped up in no more than two-three weeks (you know the old adage about cheap, fast, and good -- pick two...).

I'll see if I can get some pics of the build while my buddy Ryan (formerly of XAT) is doing it (for all intents and purposes, think of Ryan as another Boosted2.0 level toyota builder/tuner, so I'm in good hands).

And of course, if all goes well with the header project, I'll be getting one of those too, plus getting my IM ported.

If all goes according to plan, and my calculations are correct (and, shockingly, they've been pretty on target so far) I should be making around 260 or more whp when all is done. I expect to be within 25-30 whp of Ronin's car, so that is probably about right, but maybe it will be more or less -- guess we'll see.

[the ronin]

Let's hope it is at least good......remember a 2.50 pulley is as low as you go.....go with the largest bore headers you can find......

[Exotic II]

So I assume you made it into the high-mid 12's without nitrous on that run...cool. (Feel free to correct me if I am wrong...)



AWESOME!

No spray ...... I am afraid of the stuff.

[GTsRasta]

No spray ...... I am afraid of the stuff.

:D This makes me very happy. Thanks!

[jlitman]

Let's hope it is at least good......remember a 2.50 pulley is as low as you go.....go with the largest bore headers you can find......

If you are curious, here's a link to our header project. We should have the dyno results to compare to our baseline this week.
http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248877

Remarkably, so far, all has been going pretty well. It's a solid design developed by Redliner9K and PPE: 4-1, stepped primaries into a merge collector. To keep the costs down it will be built of mild steel with an optional ceramic coating.

[Celicasaur]

anyone got a link to that thread from ronin about his valves being eaten by his pistons?

[jlitman]

Here are the basic design specs of the PPE Race Header!

Mild steel water jet flange
1 5/8 primaries stepped to 1 3/4
merge collector
2 1/2" outlet
1 O2 bung
1 SS flex section
3 bolt flange outlet with matching flange to be
welded to rest of system.
flange hardware and gasket.


Here are some pictures of the header

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/Finished21.JPG

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/Outlet.JPG

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/ported_inside.JPG

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/silicabronze.JPG


Here is one of the dynos

This dyno is representative of the output of this header on the stock ECU without any tuning -- much more power should be possible with tuning!

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/Comparo_of_worst_runs21.JPG

We actually have nine dynos with the header in total, and three legitimate base line runs, same car, same shop, totally independent -- all of them show good gains, especially up top. One dyno suggested small low end losses, but the other dynos indicate that it was probably an artifact of wheel spin on that particular run.

The only caveat was that our test car had a rev limit of 7800. However, you can clearly see that it should keep pulling to 8600 RPMs without a problem (also see Redliner's conclusion #4 below).

Here are some conclusions about the performance of the header from me and from Redliner9k (our resident header expert) after reviewing all of the dynos

***My conclusions***
(1) After reviewing all the dynos, the PPE header with TRD axle back installed but cat and resonator deleted performed the best overall, even out performing the PPE header+straight pipe set up. This is with the stock ECU.

(2) Average gains are in the ball park of 5-9% in power and torque over baseline values, primarily in the top end, as would be expected.

Again that's without any tuning -- This is only the beginning!

I might add that gains of 5% to 9% up top may not sound like much, but keep in mind that a ported OEM header generally nets around 2-3% gains with maybe 1% more with de-cat (here too the decat made little difference in performance) and the WR Race Header actually loses power (not sure what %) after 7.5 K.

(3) After further review of the dynos, I've come to the conclusion that there are also decent gains (around 3-4%) in the low end, but even higher in some places according to a few of the dynos (~9%!).


**Redliner's Conclusions:**
(1) Power will keep increasing with a higher rev limiter. Looking at the graph the header is begging for revs.

(3) AFR has a LOT of breathing room. Plenty of power left to be extracted there.

(3) VVT tuning will be the key to this header so all you PFC guys get ready for some fun dyno experimentation.

(4) NEED MORE REVS!!!!!!! I see this header pulling up to 8300rpm and beyond happily. With a higher rev limiter, say 8350rpm like 2000-2001 GTS's we could be seeing an additional 3-4 whp peak over what we saw so IMO header worked beautifully. This header has alot to still show.

For more details, here is a link to the full thread on the development and testing of the PPE Header **CLICK ME** (http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248877)

More pictures (starts on p. 6) of the header as well as more dynos (starts on p. 11) can be found scattered in that thread and also in my gallery.

[Celicasaur]

Thankyou sir :)

I'll read it while eating my toast and orange juice in the morning :)

[Gravel]

I should have the block and pistons by then end of the week. The build should start next week and will hopefully be wrapped up in no more than two-three weeks (you know the old adage about cheap, fast, and good -- pick two...).

I'll see if I can get some pics of the build while my buddy Ryan (formerly of XAT) is doing it (for all intents and purposes, think of Ryan as another Boosted2.0 level toyota builder/tuner, so I'm in good hands).

And of course, if all goes well with the header project, I'll be getting one of those too, plus getting my IM ported.

If all goes according to plan, and my calculations are correct (and, shockingly, they've been pretty on target so far) I should be making around 260 or more whp when all is done. I expect to be within 25-30 whp of Ronin's car, so that is probably about right, but maybe it will be more or less -- guess we'll see.

Have you got it yet Jiltman? :shrugs:

[jlitman]

I should have the block and pistons by then end of the week. The build should start next week and will hopefully be wrapped up in no more than two-three weeks (you know the old adage about cheap, fast, and good -- pick two...).

I'll see if I can get some pics of the build while my buddy Ryan (formerly of XAT) is doing it (for all intents and purposes, think of Ryan as another Boosted2.0 level toyota builder/tuner, so I'm in good hands).

And of course, if all goes well with the header project, I'll be getting one of those too, plus getting my IM ported.

If all goes according to plan, and my calculations are correct (and, shockingly, they've been pretty on target so far) I should be making around 260 or more whp when all is done. I expect to be within 25-30 whp of Ronin's car, so that is probably about right, but maybe it will be more or less -- guess we'll see.

Have you got it yet Jiltman? :shrugs:

Supposed to come today. :D

[Gravel]

Supposed to come today. :D
:worthless: bring on the metal porn! :D

[jlitman]

Supposed to come today. :D
:worthless: bring on the metal porn! :D

I have it, but it's all boxed up. (I seriously considered posting an incredibly obnoxious picture of the two boxes as a "teaser"... but thought better of it. :D)

When the build actually begins (dropping the car and parts off, hopefully tomorrow or later this week) I'll take loads of pics.

[the ronin]

Why ? I know what it will look like :monkey: ....cool now hurry up and put it back together again.......

[jlitman]

Why ? I know what it will look like :monkey: ....cool now hurry up and put it back together again.......

Just spoke to my buddy who's doing the build... and he said can't start before this weekened at the earliest :sadpace: <-- moping

Like they say: "How do you want the work to be done? Fast, cheap, or good. Pick two." My friend's work occupies the area in a venn diagram that encompasses the latter two concepts. :shrugs:

[Gravel]

Any updates Jiltman?

[jlitman]

Any updates Jiltman?

Got postponed two weeks in a row... will be calling and begging my friend later today to start working on it already... :wtc:

[Celicasaur]

:popcorn:

[jlitman]

:popcorn:

Tell me about it. My buddy who will be doing the rebuild called me from work the other day to let me know his cell phone died. Now I can't reach him. If I don't hear from him by Monday, I'm just going to stop by his work or house to find out what's up... :faint:

He really is the only guy I trust to do this, as his work is always excellent, but good god is it hard to pin him down sometimes :(

[Celicasaur]

He really is the only guy I trust to do this, as his work is always excellent


I know what you mean, there's only one guy I trust to build my block but he lives a good few hundred miles away :bang:

I just have a nasty feeling that mine is gonna take a while to build as well. Worst thing, two companies doing two things. One for sleeving, the other for building :eek:

Keep us updated man, let's hope it works well for you :)

[jlitman]

He really is the only guy I trust to do this, as his work is always excellent


I know what you mean, there's only one guy I trust to build my block but he lives a good few hundred miles away :bang:

I just have a nasty feeling that mine is gonna take a while to build as well. Worst thing, two companies doing two things. One for sleeving, the other for building :eek:

Keep us updated man, let's hope it works well for you :)

Thanks -- will do. Good luck to you too! :)

[jlitman]

Not really an update, but I think after everything get installed I'm going to make a MUCH more detailed thread with step-by-step instructions for tuning our LTFT's with the emanage.

Anyone who is interested, here's your shopping list:
(1) A good OBDII scantool that has fast datastreaming and can record and playback data.
(2) Excel or similar spreadsheet
(3) Datalogging capability with the emanage ultiamte
(4) Considerable patience

It won't be advice for extracting maximum power; for that you need a dyno. This will just be to keep the ECU as happy as possible while driving around in part throttle. The bonus, of course, is that if all the LTFT's are close to zero, the FT that gets carried into open loop will be too small to totally screw up the WOT tune you spent your time and money getting done on the dyno.

BTW, my methods of achieving a truce with the ECU seem to really work -- even after ECU resets, even with the gimpy piston, my LTFT's range from about .08% to 5%.

[GTsRasta]

Not really an update, but I think after everything get installed I'm going to make a MUCH more detailed thread with step-by-step instructions for tuning our LTFT's with the emanage.

Anyone who is interested, here's your shopping list:
(1) A good OBDII scantool that has fast datastreaming and can record and playback data.
(2) Excel or similar spreadsheet
(3) Datalogging capability with the emanage ultiamte
(4) Considerable patience

It won't be advice for extracting maximum power; for that you need a dyno. This will just be to keep the ECU as happy as possible while driving around in part throttle. The bonus, of course, is that if all the LTFT's are close to zero, the FT that gets carried into open loop will be too small to totally screw up the WOT tune you spent your time and money getting done on the dyno.

BTW, my methods of achieving a truce with the ECU seem to really work -- even after ECU resets, even with the gimpy piston, my LTFT's range from about .08% to 5%.

Awesome. Make it sticky worthy.

[jlitman]

I'll do what I can, but there is little love for the emanage on this forum... just a few of us put our faith in the little piggyback that could (at least most of the time -- the unit DEFINITELY has some problems controlling the injectors at times, which is a wee bit scary.)

I'll (hopefully) also be able to log knock sensor data, which should be informative.

[jlitman]

Finally tracked down my buddy; everyone mutter a prayer -- if he can wrap up another car taking up space in his garage this week, I'm set for this weekend.

And, I may just have another secret project up my sleeve :naughty:

[the ronin]

Jiltman....I forgot I've got a new Emanage in the garage never used, if you want it just pay for postage and it's yours......

[zuoom]

*prayer. .P

[jlitman]

Jiltman....I forgot I've got a new Emanage in the garage never used, if you want it just pay for postage and it's yours......

Whoa! Cool -- thank you, man! I'll give a ring soon :) *prayer. .P

Much obliged ;)

[Celicasaur]

*prayer*

[matadorgts]

I'm praying my friend.

[Rombomb420]

Wow jlitman, all those posts kissing the ronin's hiney have finally paid off for you! :gap: ;) You've sunk enough $$ into your car man, you need something for free! :rofl: JK man, you know I wish you the best of luck with your project. I won't bother the big guy with prayers for your block, I have enough of my own nightmare project to pray about! You're getting enough prayers on the board tho. I would venture to say that if you are actually in the shop today it would be enough of a miracle to proclaim that Jesus built your celica! :laugh:

[jlitman]

Wow jlitman, all those posts kissing the ronin's hiney have finally paid off for you! :gap: ;) You've sunk enough $$ into your car man, you need something for free! :rofl: JK man, you know I wish you the best of luck with your project. I won't bother the big guy with prayers for your block, I have enough of my own nightmare project to pray about! You're getting enough prayers on the board tho.
You must have me confused with someone else. I'm more accurately characterized as an ass kicker.

Frank's my buddy. He and I both like to experiment with new ways to make our cars faster, and both agree that some problems are best solved with a punch to the throat. :gap:

And thank you, everyone, for your well-wishes... but looks like I'm on stand-by for another week :sadwave:

I would venture to say that if you are actually in the shop today it would be enough of a miracle to proclaim that Jesus built your celica! :laugh:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RBKTo5K14M

[Rombomb420]

Yeah that was pretty much what I was getting at! :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:

[Celicasaur]

Jiltman..shall I ask or shall I keep praying?

[firesquirrel]

:thumbdown that sucks about ur engine..

[jlitman]

I finally got the green light to drop the car off TOMORROW!!!!

Hallelujah!!! :bowdown: :applaud:


Goal (realistically, I think) is 250 -260 whp, but of course, I won't know for sure until she's back together again, broken in, tuned and dynoed :shrugs:

[the ronin]

It's about fculkin time dude....

[jlitman]

It's about fculkin time dude....

Jeez -- seriously! But the little-econobox-that-could will be in good hands with this guy, so it will be worth the wait.

Hey man -- we need to talk about headers again soon. PPE is interested in all that we previously discussed ;)

[jlitman]

It begins...

http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/engine2.jpg

Step 1: Remove Engine :p:

[The__J__Factor]

how was removal, i have to take mine out in a couple weeks any heads up would be great

[Gravel]

I parked the car in my usual spot, and when I came back, all that was left was an engine! :gap:


http://www.newcelica.org/photopost/data/500/medium/engine2.jpg





Nice to see you're build is underway :) We demand better pictures though jlitman - would you really film the birth of a child on a phone-cam?

[jlitman]

how was removal, i have to take mine out in a couple weeks any heads up would be great
My friend said it took him about 2 hrs.

Nice to see you're build is underway :) We demand better pictures though jlitman - would you really film the birth of a child on a phone-cam?

Thanks :)

Still waiting on some polyurethane motor mounts and my PPE race header; when I take them over to my friend's garage I'll get some better pics.

[GTsRasta]

I'll start the war drum beating! Good luck!

[kortik]

are you going FI or NA?
I am just wondering becuase if you going w/PPE header I thought its going to be n/a build?

[jlitman]

are you going FI or NA?
I am just wondering becuase if you going w/PPE header I thought its going to be n/a build?

I have a supercharger, remember? The header will work just fine with it...

[Boosted2.0]

did your friend mention that you are going to have to have the AC system serviced after this is done? I normally leave the compressor hooked up and in the car...

[jlitman]

did your friend mention that you are going to have to have the AC system serviced after this is done? I normally leave the compressor hooked up and in the car...

Yeah -- there's a shim for the AC clutch that popped off while on the dyno. It needs to be replaced... I've had no AC all freaking summer :wtc:

Oh, and since he'll be referred to quite a bit in this thread, my buddy's name is Ryan, also known as ToyDoctor on the Tampa Racing forum :)

[youngxlos]

DAMN!!! I didn

[jlitman]

[QUOTE=youngxlos] DAMN!!! I didn

[Gravel]

You must have missed the first round of lynching too (see further first few pages of thread...)

Short version is, a piston took out the #2 cyl bore. I have a sleeved block from MWR with Mahle pistons being assembled and will be upping the boost past 1 bar :naughty:

I have a few other goodies lined up as well :D

I hope you've got some Kevlar underwear to protect your valuables from the 20,000 rpm wood chipper you've got under the bonnet :gap:

Any more pics yet?

[jlitman]

You must have missed the first round of lynching too (see further first few pages of thread...)

Short version is, a piston took out the #2 cyl bore. I have a sleeved block from MWR with Mahle pistons being assembled and will be upping the boost past 1 bar :naughty:

I have a few other goodies lined up as well :D

I hope you've got some Kevlar underwear to protect your valuables from the 20,000 rpm wood chipper you've got under the bonnet :gap:

Any more pics yet?

Nope. I'll be getting my header and some PU engine mounts in the mail later this week, so I'll be stopping by to see how things are going then :)

[the ronin]

Hey Jiltman, Dude, check out this post on Elise Talk.... http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46368

I've been playing with CAI's and exhaust.....nice gains at 8,500 rpm's :monkey:
That dyno is conservative by 10rwhp the operator told me...
If you can post the sheets over here.....

[jlitman]

Hey Jiltman, Dude, check out this post on Elise Talk.... http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46368

I've been playing with CAI's and exhaust.....nice gains at 8,500 rpm's :monkey:
That dyno is conservative by 10rwhp the operator told me...
If you can post the sheets over here.....

Awesome! What did you do exactly?

[kortik]

yes what did you do exacltly?
and its a stock s/c on the elise right?

[many]

Hey Jiltman, Dude, check out this post on Elise Talk.... http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46368

I've been playing with CAI's and exhaust.....nice gains at 8,500 rpm's :monkey:
That dyno is conservative by 10rwhp the operator told me...
If you can post the sheets over here.....

Frank ,
What's up with the other chanel? I miss my daily nobull!

[the ronin]

Frank ,
What's up with the other chanel? I miss my daily nobull!282rwhp , 175 tq. at 8,500 rpm
to.....
299rwhp , 185 tq. at 8,500 rpm

Huge K&N filter with stright 3" tube and a freeflow 3" exhaust....Why have a stupid little CAI and a smaller 2.5" exhaust..now it breaths......

Charlie shut down monkey because I asked him to step up and do all the BS he said he could do.....well when you sling BS that's all it is......this way he dosen't have to answer the question he never heard......His Ego killed the monkey......He takes credit for my tuning and R$D.....Fuuk that..

maybe someone can post those dyno sheets here eh?