T3/T4 too big for Celicas? [Archive]

ToyoGT

05-28-2002, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by pepsiman
i jus talked with turbo performance.. and they said T3/T4 is too big for celicas...
T3 with 6psi don't satisfy me...
i need something close to 300hp...
what do u guys think?

Yeah it would be great to have 300hp but it's not as simple as adding a huge turbo and turning on the car and running it. There is a lot of things you would need to get to that desired hp level. I mean look at what they did with the EIP project car. If you are looking for that kind of power it would be easier to just sell your car and buy a MR2 or GS-T, GSX. they can get that power pretty easy, but ask Larry he will tell you, you will fight traction problems all day long. FWD cars anyway....

pepsiman

05-28-2002, 08:18 PM

true true...but high 14's don't sound really impressive
what u guys think?
i was expectin low 13's with 215hp turbocharged celica...

2002GT_Celica

05-28-2002, 08:42 PM

Originally posted by pepsiman
i jus talked with turbo performance.. and they said T3/T4 is too big for celicas...
T3 with 6psi don't satisfy me...
i need something close to 300hp...
what do u guys think?

You have been posting in every forum about how you are considering getting another car and in every thread, you bitch somehow about how the Celica falls short of your expectations. If you want 300 HP, a Celica is not going to give it to you. Why? Because there is almost no way you are going to be able to put all that power to the ground with a stock Celica tranny. If you really want 300 HP (which would be way too much for the Celica anyways) then get a Camaro or Firebird used with the LS1 engine in it and quit your *****ing.

xi KiNG ix

05-28-2002, 09:05 PM

pepsiman

05-28-2002, 09:28 PM

Originally posted by 2002GT_Celica

You have been posting in every forum about how you are considering getting another car and in every thread, you bitch somehow about how the Celica falls short of your expectations. If you want 300 HP, a Celica is not going to give it to you. Why? Because there is almost no way you are going to be able to put all that power to the ground with a stock Celica tranny. If you really want 300 HP (which would be way too much for the Celica anyways) then get a Camaro or Firebird used with the LS1 engine in it and quit your *****ing.

hey what r u sayin now?
yes im considering a GT!! so what?
i know 300hp is too much for celica... i said close to 300..
that means 250+.. u retard..
and yes.. celica was a dissapointment since we had no aftermarket support for long ass time. i have 2000 GT-S 6spd so... if you got 2002.. than shut ur holes.. cuz i waited for a turbo more than you did~
still wanna talk shiet to me?

*i had my celica for 2 1/2 yrs~ if you wanna talk ****.. please do it in my face

larryd

05-28-2002, 11:22 PM

dude grow up.. arguing will get you no where.. as it has been told to you and everyone else on here I speak from experience

300whp in a Celica is useless.. because you will literally have to replace just about everything on the drivetrain including the engine.. and then worry about traction

13s are well attainable with a GTS with moderately low boost.. 6psi would be quite enuf for low 13s with the right driver

pepsiman

05-29-2002, 09:48 AM

hmm.. im lookin at this Type-R guy with 210hp..
B18C5
pistons,rods,crankshaft,camshafts,piston rings,valvesprings,cam gears, port and polish w/ intake,exhaust,flywheel,clutch, and lsd.
no turbo...and doin low 13's..

im thinkin low 13's for my upcoming GT turbo... T3turbo w/ 10+psi.... w/ lc pistons,rods,headgasket...etc...
what do u guys think? am i dreaming?

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-29-2002, 11:21 AM

Once again... I feel the T3 or T3/T4 is ridiculous for our cars. They can only handle 13psi on stock Rods and maybe 10psi on Pistons. Unless you do thousands of dollars in engine work stick with the T28. It spools faster and will be an all around awesome turbo. Also, half the people on the board, Larry can agree with me on this one, wouldnt even know how to buy a T3/T4. How many of you know about Trim and other Turbine features and how they will affect the Celica's power and/or lag.

T28!!!

Red-one

05-29-2002, 01:01 PM

I have a T-28 in mt 1.6l acura front driver and it's good for my 12.80's timeslips........Now I will upgrade to t-3 super 60 trying to hit 11's....

BRGS
RED

P.D the T-28 I will use it in my Celi GT-s proyect....

ToyoGT

05-29-2002, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by pepsiman
true true...but high 14's don't sound really impressive
what u guys think?
i was expectin low 13's with 215hp turbocharged celica...

whoever drives a turbo celica to a high 14 in a manual should be taken out of the car and beaten like a thai hooker (i like saying that LOL). seriously i think low 14's is feasible, maybe high 13's with drag radials and low 13's strapped to the rear of our big brother- Supra ;)

ToyoGT

05-29-2002, 02:36 PM

Originally posted by pepsiman
hmm.. im lookin at this Type-R guy with 210hp..
B18C5
pistons,rods,crankshaft,camshafts,piston rings,valvesprings,cam gears, port and polish w/ intake,exhaust,flywheel,clutch, and lsd.
no turbo...and doin low 13's..

im thinkin low 13's for my upcoming GT turbo... T3turbo w/ 10+psi.... w/ lc pistons,rods,headgasket...etc...
what do u guys think? am i dreaming?

my friend's friend has a Type-R turbo and can't even break into the 13's cause his fat ass can't drive for one, and the other reason he claims is he can't hook on his tires. buy better ones jack ass ;)

ToyoGT

05-29-2002, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by Oo DaRk StAr oO
Once again... I feel the T3 or T3/T4 is ridiculous for our cars. They can only handle 13psi on stock Rods and maybe 10psi on Pistons. Unless you do thousands of dollars in engine work stick with the T28. It spools faster and will be an all around awesome turbo. Also, half the people on the board, Larry can agree with me on this one, wouldnt even know how to buy a T3/T4. How many of you know about Trim and other Turbine features and how they will affect the Celica's power and/or lag.

T28!!!

When is this turbo kit coming out? I know it was supposed to be a loooooooong time ago and yes i heard what happened which sucks, but do you guys have any idea when it will be available? i'm not flaming, just wondering. i promise :)

pepsiman

05-29-2002, 03:55 PM

Originally posted by ToyoGT

my friend's friend has a Type-R turbo and can't even break into the 13's cause his fat ass can't drive for one, and the other reason he claims is he can't hook on his tires. buy better ones jack ass ;)

straight from superstreetl... yellow Toda's typeR

2002GT_Celica

05-29-2002, 06:29 PM

Regardless, the turbos coming out for our cars are not going to give us huge straight line performance gains, since we will only be able to safely run a low boost. Once again, if you wanted straight line performance, you should not have gotten the Celica in the first place.

pepsiman

05-29-2002, 08:08 PM

Originally posted by 2002GT_Celica
Regardless, the turbos coming out for our cars are not going to give us huge straight line performance gains, since we will only be able to safely run a low boost. Once again, if you wanted straight line performance, you should not have gotten the Celica in the first place.

well im hoping for MORE aftermarket support...
im not tryin to make a 10sec car... i jus want high 12's to 13's...
don't tell me thats not impossible~
i'll wait like i waited for turbo kit for 2+yrs
+ i believe turbo performance is using T3 turbo for GT...

Tony01Gts

05-29-2002, 09:38 PM

Wouldn't a smaller turbo allow for faster spool and less lag... we already have our big second cam, a small turbo would torque up the lower rpms and would still scream in the high rpms. I think this is why a smaller turbo would be better. Our cars need help in the low rpms

My2ktoy

05-30-2002, 10:06 AM

i was thinking about this....a bigger turbo might actually be helpful...because of the longer spool up time. What is a quick spool going to get us? lots of low-end torque, and a very steep torque curve. What will this give us? lots of traction problems. Bigger turbo = slower spool = less low end power. but will that be a problem, since most people will be spinning the tires all the way through first and second? A slower spool will give us a flatter torque curve, which will help people get traction down low. Sure...technically its not as fast, but for most people out there (myself included), i think we might get better times. of course, this is all conjecture, since we'll have traction problems regardless...but still. its worth thinking about.

ToyoGT

05-30-2002, 10:30 AM

Originally posted by pepsiman

straight from superstreetl... yellow Toda's typeR

What are you talking about?

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-30-2002, 06:06 PM

Our cars arent straight line cars. We have FWD so 200+ hp is going to be awesome with a Turbo because of the torque. Also, a 10 second car... by the time you are done moding the Celica, you could have gone out, bout a MKii MR2 or Mkii Supra, thrown 400+hp on it, and been 12 second car. Trust me, this car will be 200+ hp of pure handling/speed enjoyment that will whoop any car on the streets but probly become some Supra or Trans Am's stepchild. Take it for what it is... this cars not going to be sub 11's without MAJOR overhauls. Unless ur Maef!!!

pepsiman

05-30-2002, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by MarkyMark
that's absolutely insane, there's no reason to put a big turbo in a celica like this unless you have major engine work done. It just wont handle it....

Check this out
http://www.tld.net/users/mendez/

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-30-2002, 06:58 PM

Yeah we all know about Xanatos... he boosts @ 3500rpm running 10PSI... id rather boost @ 2800RPM running 10PSI.

pepsiman

05-31-2002, 12:38 AM

yo i waited so long for WCtoyota to make us a turbo kit.
i remember david draper postin about turbo kit few months ago.. what happened? still not ready? T28 right?
well Turbo performance is using T3...
i hope WCT turbo kit comes out soon...

ToyoGT

05-31-2002, 06:27 AM

Originally posted by Oo DaRk StAr oO
O... by the time you are done moding the Celica, you could have gone out, bout a MKii MR2 or Mkii Supra, thrown 400+hp on it, and been 12 second car.

400+ at the rear and only running 12's in a Supra? If you can't drive....

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-31-2002, 11:17 AM

Originally posted by ToyoGT

400+ at the rear and only running 12's in a Supra? If you can't drive....

Thats my point. Glad some caught on =0)

ToyoGT

05-31-2002, 01:15 PM

REdGsR94

05-31-2002, 03:21 PM

this guy is running:
Drag gen III turbo kit (/w tail wastegate)
hondata 2B
3" exhuast 3" downpipe with no cat
and a thicker head gasket for lower compression

heres his dyno sheet:
http://members.aol.com/phshoops/typer/dyno2.jpg

hes running 12.9 on street tires

I think its pretty well set up.

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-31-2002, 04:17 PM

whos data sheet is that

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-31-2002, 04:18 PM

BTW thicker head gaskets dont lower compression a whole lot.

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-31-2002, 04:19 PM

also, if we had 320whp in a Celica... we'd prollie be in the low 12's... its just getting there with our engines.

REdGsR94

05-31-2002, 04:23 PM

Originally posted by Oo DaRk StAr oO
BTW thicker head gaskets dont lower compression a whole lot.

yea i know, but it does lower the compression. its some guy over at honda-tech.com with a 2000 type-r.

Very impressive with such little mods. Didnt even have any internal mods.

Oo DaRk StAr oO

05-31-2002, 04:25 PM

i think thicker head gasket takes off 1/4 or 1/3 compression. Thats why some cars have 8.25:1 compression.

TheX-Man

06-01-2002, 06:16 PM

Ok well since REdGsR94 posted that dyno I wanted to ask: With honda kits like drag 3 and rev hard uses the t3/t4, why couldn't the celicas use it with ~ the same power gains. My friend just put in the drag 3 turbo on his car and OMFG its fast. Do you think the honda kits are using to big of a turbo for their car?

Very impressive with such little mods. Didnt even have any internal mods.

No internal mods??????? wow and 320whp. I'm impressed

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-01-2002, 06:19 PM

Suit yourselves!

pepsiman

06-02-2002, 12:14 PM

Originally posted by ToyoGT

whoever drives a turbo celica to a high 14 in a manual should be taken out of the car and beaten like a thai hooker (i like saying that LOL). seriously i think low 14's is feasible, maybe high 13's with drag radials and low 13's strapped to the rear of our big brother- Supra ;)

Turbo-Performance did it!!! high 14's w/ their Turbo Kit!

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-02-2002, 12:16 PM

High 14's suck big C0ck. Maef does high 14's in high GT now!

ToyoGT

06-02-2002, 02:46 PM

Originally posted by pepsiman

Turbo-Performance did it!!! high 14's w/ their Turbo Kit!

Yeah I heard the same thing but they DID have some issues, right? I sure hope so.

ToyoGT

06-02-2002, 02:47 PM

Originally posted by Oo DaRk StAr oO
High 14's suck big C0ck. Maef does high 14's in high GT now!

Agreed :D

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-02-2002, 04:18 PM

I think our "TARGET" for the WCToyota kit is mid 13's.

pepsiman

06-02-2002, 06:09 PM

Originally posted by REdGsR94
this guy is running:
Drag gen III turbo kit (/w tail wastegate)
hondata 2B
3" exhuast 3" downpipe with no cat
and a thicker head gasket for lower compression

heres his dyno sheet:
http://members.aol.com/phshoops/typer/dyno2.jpg

hes running 12.9 on street tires

I think its pretty well set up.

hmm thats really stupid.. integra Type-R turbo?
i rather spend that much money on GSR and ill still be faster than Type-R.

ToyoGT

06-02-2002, 07:08 PM

Originally posted by Oo DaRk StAr oO
I think our "TARGET" for the WCToyota kit is mid 13's.

Hehe can't wait!!!!! more than enough for me ;)

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-02-2002, 07:39 PM

Imagine throwing on some rods and pistons... running 10psi or 12psi... 300hp @ crank maybe... thats amazing

MarkyMark

06-03-2002, 06:30 PM

Originally posted by pepsiman

Check this out
http://www.tld.net/users/mendez/

no offense to him...but are you really impressed with that??? honestly?

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-03-2002, 07:08 PM

MarkyMark as always you took the words outta my mouth.

Stories

06-03-2002, 08:42 PM

Integra Type-R with a turbo... is bastardized in my opinion because it was meant to be a N/A motor. N/A motors should be tuned to be N/A cars, not turboed or supercharged, in my opinion. That's why the Integra LS is a good choice for a turbo platform, it is a lot easier to turbo than the Type-R is. Same goes for a Celica, why do you think WC is picking the GT to turbo? The 2ZZ-GE is a great N/A motor... Lower the compression on the 2ZZ and then doesn't that just defeat the whole purpose of having the 2ZZ in the first place? A nice high-revving motor? Just my opinion...

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-03-2002, 08:45 PM

Originally posted by Stories
Integra Type-R with a turbo... is bastardized in my opinion because it was meant to be a N/A motor. N/A motors should be tuned to be N/A cars, not turboed or supercharged, in my opinion. That's why the Integra LS is a good choice for a turbo platform, it is a lot easier to turbo than the Type-R is. Same goes for a Celica, why do you think WC is picking the GT to turbo? The 2ZZ-GE is a great N/A motor... Lower the compression on the 2ZZ and then doesn't that just defeat the whole purpose of having the 2ZZ in the first place? A nice high-revving motor? Just my opinion...

:werd: :werd: :werd: :werd:!!!!!!!

4PASNU

06-04-2002, 02:52 AM

I was going to go turbo then blitz but in the end I bacame smart. The Celica is a handling and braking car. It is a road racing car not a drag car. I have bought a lot of mods for the car and it handles and accelarates nicely for me. The only way I will go F/I on the Celica is if TRD or Kazuma releases a S/C. One of my buddies has a GS-R with a JRSC and owns the local autox scene. That is my cup of tea even a 1000 hp Supra gets owned by him when cones come into play. I have my all-trac for rally racing and some drag racing. I'm going to start building my drag car and it will happen to be my car from high school, an 84 Mustang GT. It is in mint condition and is ready to be built as the true sleeper. I love imports, but bang for the buck you can't beat Detroit iron. Supra's are nice but you need deep pockets to own one. The same guy with the 1000hp Supra is still saving to drop in a new engine. He just spent 20g for the old built engine and all that it is now is a pretty paperweight. My Celica gets mad attention which is how I like it. I would like a S/C if TRD or Kazuma decides to grow some ninnes. Just my .02

Dan

larryd

06-04-2002, 03:05 AM

Originally posted by 4PASNU
I love imports, but bang for the buck you can't beat Detroit iron.

Turbo's = Replacement for Displacement :)

Celicanatic_GT

06-11-2002, 08:18 PM

will a T3 turbo fit a Celica?

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-12-2002, 12:28 AM

Anything will fit a Celica... just got to make a custom manifold.

larryd

06-12-2002, 12:46 AM

hmm.. i wonder how big of a turbo you can actually get back there seriously though.. I know some of the turbo';s Ive been lookin at I seriously doubt would fit back there like 20g turbo and T67s and stuff like tyhat

EnergieEngineer

06-12-2002, 08:52 AM

I reach high 14s in my mr2 spyder. I dont see why a turbo gt or gts couldnt hit mid-low 13s with good tires.

monkeywrench

06-12-2002, 10:49 AM

>The 2ZZ-GE is a great N/A motor... Lower the compression on >the 2ZZ and then doesn't that just defeat the whole purpose of >having the 2ZZ in the first place? A nice high-revving motor? Just >my opinion...

Lowering the compression doesn't make it rev any less, it just decreases power slightly. Now add a turbo, and you're making huge power at high RPMs where a 1ZZ would be wheezing through its smaller valves and beating up its bearings and pistons with the long stroke. Both engines are suitable for turbocharging.

Now, I do agree somewhat with the Type-R vs GSR argument. The Type-R engine is similar to the GSR engine, with higher compression and headwork. Start out with the cheaper GSR engine and port the head, and you've got the good basis for a turbo engine. The Type R's higher compression is actually a hinderance for F/I. The difference, when we start talking about 1ZZ vs 2ZZ, is that they are very different engnes. The 2ZZ has a shorter stroke and a clyinder head with more potential. Simply drop the compression and you've got the excellent basis for a turbo setup.

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-12-2002, 12:31 PM

I say T/3/4 would be hella snug.

MSR27

06-12-2002, 06:27 PM

Can someone explain to me why anybody wouldnt just use a T3/T4 instead of a T28. I understand there will be less lag and will spool up faster but wouldnt a boost controller and wastegate fix that? Are you guys saying boosting with a T3/T4 turbine @ 10psi and boosting a T28 @10psi produces the same power? Cant Xanatos just change the boost to kick in at 2800rpm?

larryd

06-12-2002, 10:26 PM

you cant change what your turbo spools up at by the wastegate or boost controller..bigger turbo take longer to spool.. thats plane and simple..

Luni420

06-13-2002, 12:11 AM

Whoa. Its been awhile since I posted here. Anyway. I have since succumbed to the dark side and got myself a 1991 MR2 Turbo. Anyway. Theres a guy with a 2000 Mr2 Spyder with a totally custom turbo kit on it and a bunch of stuff. Hes running an HKSGT25 ball bearing turbo at .9 bar (shy of 12 PSI I believe) on a 1zzfe... and He has 320 HP. I dont think he has any tranny mods, besides a clutch. I believe with the correct setup the celica can be a very good turbo car, but I do think that you have to lower the compression a little on the GTS. I also think that a T3/T4 is too large. How come nobody ever tried running a CT26. Theres a guy on the MR2 Board with a 50 Trim 12 degree clipped CT26 running high 12s. Thats quite impressive considering the size of that turbo. Also I also believe a TDO5SH 16G would be a good turbo to use on a Celica turbo kit. Anyway thats my .02

celicauk

06-13-2002, 12:22 AM

I still don't see why you can't just side mount the turbo, bring it out from behind the engione and stick it where the battery lives now, shouldn't be too difficult to do and I doubt the long runs on the pipe would be too much of a problem, especially if you insulate them well.

Course, I could be completely wrong so feel free to correct me :D

Maurice_69

06-15-2002, 10:02 AM

You guys should check out the XS Engineering turbo kit for the Celica. It spools really fast and still packs some good high-rpm punch. It's almost like a supercharger but with cooler sounds! ;)

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-15-2002, 12:31 PM

Originally posted by celicauk
I still don't see why you can't just side mount the turbo, bring it out from behind the engione and stick it where the battery lives now, shouldn't be too difficult to do and I doubt the long runs on the pipe would be too much of a problem, especially if you insulate them well.

Course, I could be completely wrong so feel free to correct me :D

That would cost SOOOOO much money and give you lag. The best place for the turbo is right where the manifold is sitting. Also, nobody knows about the XS Engineering Turbo, they cant keep it safe. There Matrix just threw a rod.

car584

06-15-2002, 12:47 PM

Guys I know that every one really wants a turbo for our Celica but come on You know the only way you can really run more the 6 or 7 psi is by totally working on your internals. Which is expensive. But the one thing that would work awesome with our car would be a supercharger . And you know that you can still put a blow off valve and intercooler on it even though it's called an after cooler. Just think about it even if you have 250 to the wheels that will be able to beat other turbos because we won't have any lag personally if you have the money go turbo if you don't get a supercharger.

BLITZ SUPERCHARGER

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-15-2002, 12:51 PM

S/C that wont work with the American ECU. That thing is turning into a joke I wish Blitz would get that thing going. As for internals, I think Rods, Pistons, and a Block Guard are the only thing we (GT Owners) need.

larryd

06-16-2002, 11:51 PM

Originally posted by celicauk
I still don't see why you can't just side mount the turbo, bring it out from behind the engione and stick it where the battery lives now, shouldn't be too difficult to do and I doubt the long runs on the pipe would be too much of a problem, especially if you insulate them well.

Course, I could be completely wrong so feel free to correct me :D

good idea but the downfall is increasing the distance the turbo is from the head will increase the lag of the turbo which would be ALOT of lag..

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-17-2002, 12:04 AM

Imagine the cost!

larryd

06-17-2002, 12:30 AM

the cost would be no more then any other exhaust manifold, its just a custom cast..

Oo DaRk StAr oO

06-17-2002, 12:31 AM

Turbo mani's are expensive when custom fabed.

celicauk

06-17-2002, 12:51 AM

Originally posted by larryd

good idea but the downfall is increasing the distance the turbo is from the head will increase the lag of the turbo which would be ALOT of lag..

Not too sure I understand why on this, surely if the piping is not restrictive (big assumption I know) the gases won't reduce velocity or change mass, which is what turns the turbine isn't it?

Don't get me wrong, I can't see you being able to install the turbo in the boot (trunk?) and getting it to work, I just thought that shifting it to the left of the engine for clearance would be ok.

larryd

06-17-2002, 01:05 AM

actually im pretty sure they do lose velocity as the distance increases.. the velocity right out of the head compared to the muffler is a huge difference

celicauk

06-17-2002, 01:10 AM

Oh, I didn't think it would lose much at all until it got to the cat. Having said that I suppose the bore of the pipe is larger than the sum total of the manifold bores so it would make sense to lose some pressure. Would this matter if you used some form of hybrid with a fast spool turbine. BTW - excuse my ignorance, I really don't know that much about turbos.