hotchkis comp sway questions

[Punkers7465]

Hey you guys, I just got done installing my hotchkis rear comp sway bar and the car handles beautifully. I'm really impressed with how well it turns in, my celica just refuses to understeer. So what I've been wondering is... Is it going to feel even better with the front sway installed? (installed on the softer setting of course) I'm just afraid that I'll go through all the effort to install the front sway and then the celica will simply plow straight through corners like it used to... any advice?

and if you guys convince me to go through with the install, any tips on doing it? My car is dropped about 1.5'' will the sway get in the way of power steering etc?

Thanks in advance! :gap:

[verbal272]

Soft front stiff rear, thats how you generally want to keep a FF

[JOHN_B]

the pros having the front is less body roll, but you'll get understeer back not sure by how much understeer. I have a 3pt brace and ST rear sways, both are working great (Not best in snow condition). I'm putting the front on soon.

[Punkers7465]

I currently have a trd 3pt rear brace, and hotchkis springs as well as the rear hotchkis comp sway, and I know I want my rear bar quite a bit stiffer than my front... (duh) And I know that the hotchkis front sway is supposedly a fair amount softer than the rear (I've actually heard the the comp front sway is the same as the street one) but I'm not sure if upgrading my front sway is going to be helpful... Oh and my celica isn't driven in the snow and rarely in the rain, so those factors aren't important I just want maximum dry handling ability.

What I'm really looking for is someone whose driven (preferably in autocross/road course) in a celica with a rear sway, and then with both sways to give their impressions. So John_B make sure to let me know what you think after installing your front sway! :)

edit: I just looked it up, the hotchkis street and comp front bar are the same. And they claim (on the softer setting) the front bar is 43% over o.e. while the rear bar is 123% over o.e.

any advice?

[leppardized]

I just installed Hotchkis Comp sways F+R / Hotchkis springs w/KYB AGX and i get near 0 understeer. I have tried to get it to understeer but the only time it has so far was when I hit lift while turning in 1st gear. I'm simply amazed at the abilty of the setup to negate understeer. I dont have the TRD rear bar so you should be even better off than I am.

[kimGT]

I think i'd just go with the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mentality here. you seem very happy with this setup so why change it?

[zero2toy]

well he paid for it, and im sure hodgkins made the set up to work together. I say throw it on, it will probably give even better over all handling, and maybe(MAYBE) a slight bit more understeer, but you will be able to power out of your turns better due to less body roll, keeping your tires flat to the road, traction is the most important part of turning.

good luck with the install, you basically have to drop the sub frame, unless you have a lift that you can use, then i think you can get it out with some fenagling. Just take a look at it and go from there, its like anything, look and see how you can get it out, and go that way.

[Punkers7465]

I think i'd just go with the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mentality here. you seem very happy with this setup so why change it?

Why do we mod our cars at all? To make them better of course! The more I think about it... I already have the front sway so I might as well try it out, I can always put the stock back on if it's not my cup of tea. :gap: I dunno, I wont have time to install it for a couple weeks so who knows I might change my mind by then...

On a side note: I wouldn't suggest a comp rear bar alone for a celica that is driven in snow as there is a fair amount of lift off oversteer that could be scary in bad conditions. And by a fair amount of oversteer, I mean I can completely break the rear tires loose mid corner simply by lifting some throttle. Although despite this, the handling isn't twitchy or at all unpredictable, I'm really happy with it.

Any more advice/opinions?

[kimGT]

Why do we mod our cars at all? To make them better of course!..................


.......................the handling isn't twitchy or at all unpredictable, I'm really happy with it.



i understand that, but i'm just suggesting that since you said it yourself that you are really happy with it you might as well enjoy it. people would kill for handling like you just described. Imagine going into any high speed sweeper, and powering through, and if you needed to rotate the car abit, just lift off, and gas up when you need to bring the tail back in. All that without any twitchiness or nervous feeling. sounds like a good setup to me.

The more I think about it... I already have the front sway so I might as well try it out, I can always put the stock back on if it's not my cup of tea.

i can almost garantee that after that install (if you do this yourself) you will not want to re-do this ever again, even if you needed to. Then again, adding 43% stiffness to the front may make the car even better....

[Gt to GtS Swap]

I want to know whats going on with this too! BUMP someone with install expierence on one then both enlighten us!

[Punkers7465]

Imagine going into any high speed sweeper, and powering through, and if you needed to rotate the car abit, just lift off, and gas up when you need to bring the tail back in....

No need to imagine, it's been done and it's awesome. :D


i can almost garantee that after that install (if you do this yourself) you will not want to re-do this ever again, even if you needed to. Then again, adding 43% stiffness to the front may make the car even better....
That may is what's killing me. I think if I decided not to install the front one I would have forever have a voice in the back of my head telling me that it could, maybe, possibly be better, and that'll drive me crazy. As far as the install goes I've got a parter in crime that will probably help me out, hopefully. And if it feels even slightly worse after I put it on it is without a doubt coming off. No matter how much of a pain it might be.

It'll probably be a couple weeks before I get the time to install it but I'll keep you guys updated after I put it in!

any other thoughts?

[Punkers7465]

Well I delayed installing the front sway for a few after my endlinks started giving me problems. But after getting some powergrid endlinks (http://www.powergridinc.com/) I installed my front sway and...

Long story short, I'm happy with it. I wouldn't recommend it to those who are interested in autocross because the turn in isn't as sharp as it used to be. It seems like it it quite isn't as "flickable" either, it's not as willing to oversteer like it used to. So at this point you're probably wondering why I'm happy with it. Well for the tiny little bit of turn in/oversteer that I lost I more than made up for in balance. The car no longer feels like it wants to let the back in come around, it feels more solid around corners. And while exiting a corner with a decent bit of throttle the car will progressively oversteer unlike before where it was a far less progressive process. The car feels like it makes smoother transitions where from left to right, or vice versa it doesn't feel like it's transferring nearly as much weight. Before you had to be slightly careful when maneuvering around a tight s bend because while it wasn't twitchy, if you were a bit too excited/going too fast while flicking in/out you might have ended up facing backwards. Where as now the oversteer, while still there, is much more gradual. I couldn't be happier with the result!

[renfield90]

I've been told by some that you can get a stiffer front sway bar to work right on the Celica but you need some pretty stiff front springs to do it.

[kimGT]

glad you like it but don't you miss the super sharp and quick steering?

what do you have the front bar set at? reg or the stiffer setting?

[Punkers7465]

glad you like it but don't you miss the super sharp and quick steering?

what do you have the front bar set at? reg or the stiffer setting?

it's set on the less stiff setting... I would think it might start to understeer a little bit on the stiffer.

The steering is still super sharp, it just has a wee little bit less initial turn it. Although I'm willing to sacrifice that little bit of initial turn it to have a car that feels less inclined to let the back end go. Dont get me wrong, it still oversteers even with decent throttle being applied; but it when it lets the back come out it does so in a much more forgiving and progressive manner.

Hey kimGT, what suspension set-up do you have now other than the bilstein coilovers? And how do you like the bilsteins?

[robare99]

how hard was the install? I have my front sway sitting in my garage. One of those "get to it someday" kinda deals.

[Punkers7465]

how hard was the install? I have my front sway sitting in my garage. One of those "get to it someday" kinda deals.

Getting the stock front sway out is a little bit of a pain... I wouldn't say it's a difficult install by any means, but it's a little bit frustrating having to unbolt most of the subframe just to get to the darn thing.

If you have any questions on the install feel free to pm me and I can help you out.