Length of Adjustable Endlinks?

[Kangaruu]

Sorry if this was answered before but I couldn't find any threads about this...

But my question is how does the length of the endlinks affect the performance of the sway bars?

Is it like if the endlinks are longer, the sway bars "become" stiffer and reduces roll more effectively and vice versa for being shorter?

Thanks a bunches for the help guys :)

[kimGT]

well adjustable endlinks serve the purpose of allow you to relieve tension off the sway bar at static ride height. this is especially helpful for those with lowered static height, so there is not preload on the bar. if you had some preload on the sway bar, wether it be tension or compression it, will cause roll stiffness to be greater when turning in one direction vs the other, so the car will handle differently in left vs right hand corners.

good thing about going to adjustables is that they usually use spherical bearings vs. rubber bushings.

[Kangaruu]

So... Does lengthening the endlinks increase the preload or decrease it?

I guess I couldn't word my question in the first post correctly. Sorry :)

[kimGT]

increase, either way (shorter or longer) its going to put a force on the bar, and is generally not desirable.

[Kangaruu]

What the heck, hahah

How do I get rid of the preload then or is that not possible?

[kimGT]

it is, when your car is on level ground and at rest your endlinks ideally should be at a 'neutral' setting with no tension on the bar.

A simple explanation of how sways work is that when you compress the right front wheel it acts on the bar through the end link. In turn, the bar then acts on the left front wheel through the other endlink. If the car is lower and the end links are the stock length, then the bar already has tension on it, which is generally not desirable.

[Kangaruu]

Oh shoot, I adjusted them to all stock height, lmao. Gotta fix that then.

Is there a method to set the tension to neutral?

[TaeMachine]

like kim said, set car on the ground then attach the endlinks.

[Kangaruu]

How do you get to the endlinks while the car is resting on the ground?

I can hardly touch the endlinks that way with the wheels still on and I have skinny arms >.>

[kimGT]

The force vector changes when one endlink is shorter than the other, try to make them the same length. Set the endlinks as vertical in two axis as possible and try to make sure the bar ends are horizontal...horizontal may or may not be possible, but this orientation will give you a feel for how long the links should be given your ride hieght. You can then play with the endlink length - equally side to side - if you want to feel how a longer vs shorter measurement affect the 'laziness' or sharpness in response since the length of the endlinks affect the sway bar leverage. DIY you might have to do some testing.

I had a pro set mine while the car was on a ramp. This was necessary because I wanted my weight accounted for. Lowering the static ride height has no affect on the sway bar pre-load if the lowering is equal side to side, and previously no pre-load existed. with my weight the car is abit lower on the drivers side. so i had the car corner weighted and height and alignment setup with respect. this means the endlinks may not be the same length.

[Kangaruu]

Ohh okay.

You gave me an idea on how to do this myself.

Thanks a lot Kim and Tae :)

[kimGT]

don't thank me, taemachine did all the work.:jerkoff:


j/k :gap:

[vegeta4ss]

i've got the powergrid endlinks and am still battling finding that perfect length.

it looks as if i'm going to have to try it with my car on an alignment rack to get it totally neutral. So if your trial and error runs seem to not make any progress, then go to the alignment shop.

[TaeMachine]

don't thank me, taemachine did all the work.:jerkoff:


j/k :gap:

Are you going to autox this Sunday?

[kimGT]

yeah, i'm trying to finally get myself a legal helmet.

i hate my current one, it doesn't fit and isn't even snell or dot approved.

[vegeta4ss]

ok so with a new set of tires and some endlink lengthening everything is way better now.

my rear end is still a little floaty. My front swaybar ends are almost parallel with the ground now, however the rear is still quite far from there. I figure that is due to the Speedfried kit being installed.

So what should I do, keep adding length? I dunno if these powergrids go long enough to make the rear parallel with the road. Hell, i might even be misinformed there too.

[vegeta4ss]

ok so with a new set of tires and some endlink lengthening everything is way better now.

my rear end is still a little floaty. My front swaybar ends are almost parallel with the ground now, however the rear is still quite far from there. I figure that is due to the Speedfried kit being installed.

So what should I do, keep adding length? I dunno if these powergrids go long enough to make the rear parallel with the road. Hell, i might even be misinformed there too.

I'm still having this issue. The front endlink length is 11 3/8" from joint center to joint center. This almost leaves the swaybar ends perfectly horizontal and parallel with the ground. Using the outer adjustment hole on the bar (closest to motor). This is the main changes to the front setup: [powergrid endlinks, Tein stech/tokico HP's, 215/45/17 kuhmos]


The rear endlinks are about 5.75" (IIRC) joint center to joint center. The swaybar ends are almost perfectly vertical. The speedfried kit has been installed on the rear crossmember, in addition to the spring/shock change. So the car's ~2-2.5" lower in the rear than stock setup. (its actually way lower, even with my subs removed than the front is)

^ this probably wont make much sense..but....the rear doesn't feel "planted" evenly at all times despite the fact i've checked the lengths and they are spot on even. The only way i've been able to induce the feeling I was once used to is to drop the front tire pressure by 3lbs and increase my curve entry speed.

before installing my speedfried/whiteline roll coupler kit and powergrid endlinks the rear end felt more pronounced and more crisp with its response. Now there are many times where I have to lift off because it starts to feel "floaty" in the back.

So, what can I check/remove/adjust to counteract this? I was thinking maybe remove the front strut bar, but i'm probably wrong. My trial and error diagnosis methods are seriously lacking, lol.

The way I have adjusted the endlinks is a crude one, but I took the OEM ones and measured and added a half inch and set them. Then I went back on the front and added another .25" roughly. The rears are still only 1/2" longer than OEM link, I have not adjusted them again yet because I am running out of remaining stud to adjust on. I wish I had a rack to put the car on and align it and quickly zero out these swaybars once and for all.

here's the other changes that i have made to the car (only the powergrid and the speedfried kit are recent additions)

-RMM front strut twr bar
-Cusco lower tie front
-M.R. lower tie rear
-Hypermotive 3pt rear strut twr bar


This summer:
___________
ES front L.C.A kit installed
es rack/pinion kit installed
prothane rear l.c.a kit installed


KimGT or TaeMachine could you shed some light on why this is happening? I still dont know a ton about susp stuff but i'm trying :gap: and you guys seem to have a better grasp than I on the major concepts.

I have to do an alignment very soon for these new tires, given the changes I have made what specs should I go with for a daily driver that never tracks the car anymore? Just spirited backroad driving. What changes should I make to that (and to the endlinks) when I put in all that new urethane?

lastly,

my PS feels less and less responsive as time goes on. I replaced my fluid with Royal Purple (I even flushed again after 300 miles to get the loose trash out) but didn't notice a difference. Other than the rack bushings, is there anything else that would wear and reduce the steering?


*sorry for writing a book guys, I just had to lay it all out while it was in my head*

[euromotorsports]

have you had any problems with your endlinks, I bent my rear endlinks from.... I forgot the name but the groupbuy going on around here for the adjustalbe endlinks

[vegeta4ss]

have you had any problems with your endlinks, I bent my rear endlinks from.... I forgot the name but the groupbuy going on around here for the adjustalbe endlinks

you mean the ones that De' made? his name on here was oneblackgts.

I never bent his, but I did almost pop the heim joint out of one of the rears. I've not used those for a while. I went from his, back to OEM, and then on to the powergrids for the last 2 months or so.

[kimGT]

You can then play with the endlink length - equally side to side - if you want to feel how a longer vs shorter measurement affect the 'laziness' or sharpness in response since the length of the endlinks affect the sway bar leverage. DIY you might have to do some testing.



so you just have a problem with the rear?

mark or measure and record the length now, go for a drive on a local familiar road, and remember how it feels in corners. try shortening the link to stock or shorter and see if that helps.

and raise your rear tire pressure, but not at the same time so you know if shortening the endlinks solved it (could moving and installing roll kit ruined your rear alignment?) can't tell you much about the P/S, i did a flush and fill with redline and its great.

[vegeta4ss]

i haven't aligned since the endlinks, new tires, or the roll kit install....so that could be it. I plan to do it soon however.

I'll try your suggestions for the rear ones and post back if it helps.

[bunkkaws84]

Ohh okay.

You gave me an idea on how to do this myself.

Thanks a lot Kim and Tae :)



maybe back up your car onto ramps? You know the ones you can get from the auto store?

Edit: Rhino Ramps is what I believe they are called.

[kimGT]

jeez i just noticed that you have 79 trader rating!! powerseller much?

[vegeta4ss]

^ I used to run groupbuys for KARacing.

Also, I emptied out my parts closet and made a final list of what I was going to use. The rest of the items I sold, lol. I can see my closet floor again!