Ford wants me DEAD!! [Archive] - NewCelica.org Forum

SlasherX

01-29-2002, 08:38 PM

Originally posted by huangc2
35 is kinda of high for a cobra, considering I'm more than sure you know how to mod stangs. You know good and well you can get a 96-98 mod motor cobra and make it run 11's for about 20K. Even a new SOHC GT can run 11's less than 35K, ford has a problem with overcharging for their aftermarket/limited production cars.

we also knwo that you can get a fox 5.0 running 10's for under 5 grand...

the cobra's gonna have IRS, a factory warranteed blower with intercooling, the t-56 tranny mounted to an improved IRS...

i think its worth every penny...the internals are going to be forged too, so just up the boost to your hearts content.

keep in mind WS6's are right about tehre as well after you get done with dealer markups and such.

i just am in awe that Ford is dropping these cars out of nowehre..it all started with teh bullitt, then the GT-40, now this..

what a fitting way for Ford to say goodbye to the F-Body :0 *snicker*
hehe :)

SlasherX

01-29-2002, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by racinjason
Z3's had a 6speed available as well. FYI! Both the Camaro and Z3 had misshifting problems as well.

not even close to teh amount that celica's have had..cmon, you know better.

SlasherX

01-29-2002, 08:55 PM

4.6 4v iron block w/ Eaton blower
6spd transmission
390hp
390 torque
3500lbs
155mph (governed)
175mph w/o governer
17x9" rims
275/40-17 F-1 tires
Bilstein struts&shocks
New hood, spoiler, mirrors
Aluminum flywheel & driveshaft
ect......;.
base price est...$35,000 or just below
first deliveries expected May/June 2002

Da Kine Guy

01-29-2002, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by SlasherX

not even close to teh amount that celica's have had..cmon, you know better.

This could be because it seems like there are a lot of first time manual drivers taking there learning steps on a GT-S, not really the ideal car of choice to learn on. I drove an older 5 speed for about 3 years prior to getting my Celica and find the 6-speed just fine. All I am having to get used to is the placement of Reverse and having so many damn gears to play with. I know it's only one more gear, but for some reason it really feels like I have a whole lot more with the five speed. Oh yeah, having to downshift more then one gear on the highway to accelerate is also kinda weird. All I mentioned is completely liveable and it'll just take a little time for me to get used to it.

As for the Celica impact, I most Definately see it. Never saw a sport-compact or any car in this class coming with 6-speeds, only after the Celica has this phenomenon taken place. RSX Type-S, Focus SVT, Matrix (it's Toyota though so doesn't really count, neither does it's American twin), and probably a whole lot more to come. Are the new VW's 6-speed? I wouldn't be surprised to see 6-speeds become a lot more common in future years.

larryd

01-29-2002, 11:10 PM

sounds nice.. but that price tag is a little too much IHMO

hollywood

01-30-2002, 12:58 AM

its still a rustang. im so sick of seeing those things. i cant drive a mile without seeing one.

Phil C

01-30-2002, 06:16 AM

I'm curious to hear why you think the 390 is under-rated. Given Ford's recent history with horsepower lies...we all remember the '99 Cobra don't we? And reports of the same on the F-150 Lightning. Why would you expect anything to change.

If you think $35,000 for a Ford is expensive imagine paying an estimated $100,000+ for the new GT-40 if it gets a green light.

IMO, until Ford does more work with variable valve trains like they have in the new SVT Focus they will lag behind the imports, both Japanese and European. I mean lets be honest here we are talking about having to use a blower to reach the HP level that BMW and others have gotten NA from a similar size engine.

Chumpchiggy

01-30-2002, 06:36 AM

Originally posted by Phil C
I'm curious to hear why you think the 390 is under-rated. Given Ford's recent history with horsepower lies...we all remember the '99 Cobra don't we? And reports of the same on the F-150 Lightning. Why would you expect anything to change.

If you think $35,000 for a Ford is expensive imagine paying an estimated $100,000+ for the new GT-40 if it gets a green light.

IMO, until Ford does more work with variable valve trains like they have in the new SVT Focus they will lag behind the imports, both Japanese and European. I mean lets be honest here we are talking about having to use a blower to reach the HP level that BMW and others have gotten NA from a similar size engine.

Very good point here Phil. I remember my brother when he first dyno'd his 99 cobra.... he was so pissed when he only put about 270 hp to the ground... Of course, Ford did fix the problem...

I just can't see paying $35k for a car like this... I can see it in the $27k - $30k range but.... that price tag is rediculous....

jotan82

01-30-2002, 06:45 AM

for 35k you can have a civic into the 10's.... lol

j/p

i don't know much about mustangs... but it does seem like FORD is tryin to run the show...

djm221

01-30-2002, 08:04 AM

Originally posted by Phil C
I mean lets be honest here we are talking about having to use a blower to reach the HP level that BMW and others have gotten NA from a similar size engine.

Can you list some of those for me? The M3 is the highest I know of (Ferrari excluded), and that's only 333HP, plus a lot less torque than this thing.
If it works, then who cares what technology it uses. The LS6 or whatever the hell is in the Z06 puts out 405HP, and the damn car still gets over 25mpg on the highway and close to 20 city (of course, that isn't WOT driving). The M3 doesn't get that fuel economy.

Maybe if they make the suspension as good as the power numbers (and reliability and good seats and stuff would be nice), it would be worth the $35,000.

WillyK

01-30-2002, 08:44 AM

I think it sounds pretty nice, although pretty expensive. Maybe they are targeting the Corvette now. I wonder how it would compare against a Corvette in 1/4 and handling etc.

SloGTS

01-30-2002, 08:47 AM

How about the M5

djm221

01-30-2002, 09:37 AM

Originally posted by SloGTS
How about the M5

Hmm, slipped my mind for some reason. Still, it is 4.9l, and the torque is lower. and the fuel economy isn't as good as the Z06 (it weighs more though). Anyway, the point was, it doesn't matter what techno and engine employs if the end product is the same. Besides, with these boosted engines, it's easier/cheaper to get more power than with NA.

Phil C

01-30-2002, 12:02 PM

To some extent I agree with you that it doesn't matter what technology is used to reach the goal but at the same time using boost to overcome the limitations of an engine platform and the 4.6 SOHC or DOHC has a few limitations seems like a real backwards way to do it.

The first engine that came to mind was the M5 4.9 as a candidate for doing this same thing NA. To be honest I can't think of another candidate right now in the under 5.0 range that fits the bill. In the slightly over 5. litre range you get the Mercedes 5.5's and the Chevy 5.7's, which aren't even OHC engines.

Some 2001/2002 M3 owners are reporting to Roundel in excess of 30MPG on the highway due to the ability to cruise at 70MPH and be at 2100 RPM in sixth gear. Can't imagine babying that car enough to get good gas mileage though.

SlasherX

01-30-2002, 01:36 PM

you guys are missing the point here.

its a factory warranteed supercharger with intercooler. MUCH easier to get power from. Keeps R&D costs down as well for developing a larger block to make SS level power(notice they need to use a 5.7 to make that kind of power N/A)

now why isn't it impressive? oh yeah..BMW or Ferrari has this or that..PLEASE..its a freakin COBRA, not a 50k euro, or an exotic.

as for the price tag...normal cobras before this would run up to 32k, even as high as 34k with teh convertible..so you throw in a new beefier block built for the supercharger setup, add an intercooler, tune it, throw in the other minor upgrades, adjust for infation..and how is 35k looking so bad? Cobra's were never cheap in their time period.

here's the article for you guys to glance over a bit more yourselves...keep in mind this is a COBRA, not a expensive M3, or even more expensive M5 here...thats a totally different class..sheesh.

http://pub57.ezboard.com/fmmjaxfrm6.showMessage?topicID=83.topic

as for underrating the cars..well..since 99 Ford has underrated several..for instance

Gt's rated at 260hp...regularly dyno around 225-230rwhp...thats about 270+ at the crank

Bullit's, rated at 265hp..dyno around 240-245 at teh wheels..thats about 280-290 at the crank

2001 Cobra's..the first one since the 99 debacle..dynoed as high as 290rwhp..thats about 340 at teh crank, advertised at 320.

the Cobra R..rated at 385hp...guess what..they DYNOED at 385rwhp..so thats over 420hp at teh crank

as for proof that the cobra is underrated at 390..its running 8lbs of boost..on a saleen or other blown 4v's, 8lbs is worth 100hp regularly...ALSO...if you read the article, they mention that without the speed governor the car can hit 175mph...now there is no way in hell that a 3500lbs car with only 390bhp is hitting 175 mph with the aerodynamics of the mustang..get real here...its GOTTA be underrated.

keep in mind this 420hp Cobra R used a 5.4 sohc engine, and the cobra's using a 4.6...hence why it would be a lot cheaper to add a blower to teh 4.6 than stuff a 5.4 under the hood(doesnt fit without chasis mods/aslo screws up weight dist. and CAFE ratings)

anotehr thing...the lightning has used a blower on its 5.4 for years now and people havent seemed to have a problem with that...now whats so hard about a 4.6 with one?

as for problems with teh blower on that block? *shrugs* who cares? its under warranty..and from experience with those motors, a personw ould have to boost the hel out of that block to blow anything..can you say all forged internals on a cast iron block? you just arent going to see them on teh side of the road anytime soon.

as for them challenging the vette? well..the ZO6 yes, but the regular vette no...it should be much quicker than the reg. vette...for 5k-10k less.

cobra's power to weight is 11lbs to every 1hp roughly
vipers was 10lbs to every 1..prob. lower now with teh new engine..but this should show you something..the car is going to go like a bat outta hell

WillyK

01-30-2002, 01:52 PM

The arguement about it using a supercharger is lame. It's the same people with Celicas or Civics whining that if the WRX didn't have a turbo it wouldn't be anything. Like SlasherX said you can just up the boost much easier than building up an NA car. If I had the money, I would consider this Mustang.

SlasherX

01-30-2002, 01:59 PM

Originally posted by WillyK
The arguement about it using a supercharger is lame. It's the same people with Celicas or Civics whining that if the WRX didn't have a turbo it wouldn't be anything. Like SlasherX said you can just up the boost much easier than building up an NA car. If I had the money, I would consider this Mustang.

exactly... the only people who say hp/liter, or needing a supercharger, blah blah blah are the ones who lose the race.

you run what you brung.

NSX_GTR_LM

01-30-2002, 02:00 PM

what is the coefficient of drag on a mustang? I don't see why 175 seems so out of reach if the coeeficient is under .35, but I don't know what the coefficient is =)

SlasherX

01-30-2002, 02:04 PM

Originally posted by NSX_GTR_LM
what is the coefficient of drag on a mustang? I don't see why 175 seems so out of reach if the coeeficient is under .35, but I don't know what the coefficient is =)

haha honestly its right about .35 ;)

its a flying brick at those speeds, the 99 redesign didnt help

Jesse IL

01-30-2002, 02:24 PM

T-56 transmission is the same trans that has been available in the Camaro/Firebird since 1993 (not 1994), and the Corvette got a 6-speed (although it was made by ZF and not Borg-Warner) in 1991 when it got the LT1.

"am i the onyl one creaming my pants over this? :D i give this car mid 12's stock...give it a dif pulley, chip and gears and i can so see 11's... "

Yes...Suzuki GSX-1300R Hayabusa. $10,849 MSRP, low 10's stock...lowered, extended swingarm, mid 9's. Hehe

SlasherX

01-30-2002, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by Jesse IL
T-56 transmission is the same trans that has been available in the Camaro/Firebird since 1993 (not 1994), and the Corvette got a 6-speed (although it was made by ZF and not Borg-Warner) in 1991 when it got the LT1.

"am i the onyl one creaming my pants over this? :D i give this car mid 12's stock...give it a dif pulley, chip and gears and i can so see 11's... "

Yes...Suzuki GSX-1300R Hayabusa. $10,849 MSRP, low 10's stock...lowered, extended swingarm, mid 9's. Hehe

true true...cant beat a crotch rocket..but id rather be i a car goign that fast than a bike :) call me a big puss...just never got into wanting a bike after all the accidents ive seen

Vroom_Vroom

01-30-2002, 03:08 PM

OOOO A NEW Z06 contender!...the new zo6's have 405hp...so thats right around the ball park! SLASHER GOT ANY PICS!?

SlasherX

01-30-2002, 10:23 PM

Originally posted by Vroom_Vroom
OOOO A NEW Z06 contender!...the new zo6's have 405hp...so thats right around the ball park! SLASHER GOT ANY PICS!?

go to teh link i posted..its the complete article.

Jesse IL

01-30-2002, 10:33 PM

If I were building up a Mustang, I'd try and find a '93 Cobra. Those were always my favorites.

A i

01-30-2002, 11:13 PM

Looks real nice, and those rims are sweet.

huangc2

02-03-2002, 08:18 PM

Slasher, what is the amount of vehicles to be built? If it's limited like the Cobra R, we might as well say fuhgitdaboutit. Try 5K over sticker, that's what most dealers were doing with the R, don't get me wrong I would get that ride in a heart beat if I can get it at cost which I highly doubt. But if I can, it would be nice. I guess the price isn't too bad but maybe at cost it would be a little more feasible.

SlasherX

02-04-2002, 07:32 AM

Originally posted by huangc2
Slasher, what is the amount of vehicles to be built? If it's limited like the Cobra R, we might as well say fuhgitdaboutit. Try 5K over sticker, that's what most dealers were doing with the R, don't get me wrong I would get that ride in a heart beat if I can get it at cost which I highly doubt. But if I can, it would be nice. I guess the price isn't too bad but maybe at cost it would be a little more feasible.

well, this is the new cobra period. meaning that they all are gonna be like this..no more n/a 4.6 dohc. so if it sanything lie usual there should be the regular 5,000 made a model year.

dealer markup shouldnt be too bad considering the car won't be nearly as rare as the R was.

and i've been looking for a 93 cobra for awhile now..thinking of turning the v6 into the DD, autocrosser and using the cobra to burn the 1320 down :)

huangc2

02-04-2002, 02:55 PM

5000 total units, hmm I wonder how many will be slated for conv and how many for hard top. If I ever can afford one, I will definitely get a hard top, the thought of getting thrown from a conv after doing defensive driving gives me the creeps.

huangc2

02-04-2002, 08:36 PM

Now slasher, why does ford want you dead?

SlasherX

02-04-2002, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by huangc2
Now slasher, why does ford want you dead?

cuz my next car is gonna be a cobra and i've been saving and looking around for months..hehe..

still split on a 93 cobra and the 5.0 platform, or this newest one(if all works out next semester)

*dreams of a boosted v8*

huangc2

02-05-2002, 01:14 PM

Slasher, I am going to work at Ford this summer as a collections representative just so I can buy that cobra for invoice. Tee hee hee, all I have to do is work there for 4 months and I can get any car for cost!!!

2000 XYR

02-05-2002, 05:15 PM

SlasherX said:
*dreams of a boosted v8* Yeah, me too. :D One of my dreams is parked outside. The other is a Supra TT. I guess that's next. ;)

SlasherX

02-05-2002, 06:59 PM

Originally posted by huangc2
Slasher, I am going to work at Ford this summer as a collections representative just so I can buy that cobra for invoice. Tee hee hee, all I have to do is work there for 4 months and I can get any car for cost!!!

HOOK a brotha up!!

hehe..nah im not looking to purchase until october-ish..

01MustangGT

02-05-2002, 10:17 PM

It's time to get some respect from LS1 owners hahahahah

CB-GTS

02-05-2002, 10:53 PM

You have to be out of your mind to even think that car is worth looking at never mind buying. Ohh im so impressed 390 hp in a Ford. If I ever was stupid enough to buy American I'll take that Corvette over that box of rust and bolts you call a Ford Mustang. I really don't care how you dress it up or what you call it. It still is an over priced way out dated piece of s@it!!!!

01MustangGT

02-05-2002, 11:44 PM

Originally posted by CB-GTS
You have to be out of your mind to even think that car is worth looking at never mind buying. Ohh im so impressed 390 hp in a Ford. If I ever was stupid enough to buy American I'll take that Corvette over that box of rust and bolts you call a Ford Mustang. I really don't care how you dress it up or what you call it. It still is an over priced way out dated piece of s@it!!!!
Come on dude, u r just jealous. Don't bring Corvette here please. "If i ever was stupid enough to buy Japanese I'll take that RSX over that box of rust you call a GTS." However, i don't need that much power to smoke ur piece of sh*t that is called GTS. Wat i need is just a GT to leave u in dust.
So watch out CB-GTS

Acilec

02-06-2002, 06:17 AM

Originally posted by 01MustangGT

Come on dude, u r just jealous. Don't bring Corvette here please. "If i ever was stupid enough to buy Japanese I'll take that RSX over that box of rust you call a GTS." However, i don't need that much power to smoke ur piece of sh*t that is called GTS. Wat i need is just a GT to leave u in dust.
So watch out CB-GTS

Seriously man, I have to question your sanity by being on this forum. YOU HAVE A MUSTANG. Either be cool like the other Mustang owners here or go find your own forum. At least show some respect, we all love cars don't we? This goes for you too CB-GTS. Let's all behave like civilized humans who have something in common about cars, whether they're Japanese or American.

You see, I'm not even dissing your Mustang, even though I've beaten 2 of your kind with no problems. Don't count your chickens before they're hatched.

Kiss and make up! Damn it.

:bang:

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 07:14 AM

Originally posted by Acilec

Seriously man, I have to question your sanity by being on this forum. YOU HAVE A MUSTANG. Either be cool like the other Mustang owners here or go find your own forum. At least show some respect, we all love cars don't we? This goes for you too CB-GTS. Let's all behave like civilized humans who have something in common about cars, whether they're Japanese or American.

You see, I'm not even dissing your Mustang, even though I've beaten 2 of your kind with no problems. Don't count your chickens before they're hatched.

Kiss and make up! Damn it.

:bang:

good messge..

one problem

"15.8 @ 85mph"

if the mustang GT was from 82, then yes ill believe ya..otherwise..NO.

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 07:15 AM

Acilec

02-06-2002, 07:24 AM

Hi Dave,

Yeah man, I fully know that I should have had my ass kicked by these GT's in a 1/4 mile situation, but like I said before It's true and I blame it on two things: 1.) The mustangs were automatic and 2.), the driver sucked. Therefore, racing on the streets is different. No disrespect, but I'm not a liar. I've beaten two. A kill is a kill. But I fully admit that in a realistic 1/4 mile situation with a good driver and manual transmission, I would not stand a chance. Unless I get some more mods :-)

Best regards,

Fin

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 07:29 AM

back to the topic...

rumor is the internals are completely forged with manley shotpeened rods.

keep in mind all factory...

the aluminum flywheel and driveshaft are common aftermarket parts from ford motorsport...now stock on the cobra

the block used to be all aluminum, but ford ditched that for a beefier iron block so you can up the boost much higher=more reliablity

the interior was slightly redesigned(center console, ebrake handle, different color fabrics, etc) in 01.

the IRS has been improved on once again..if youll remmeber in 2000 the cobra was not released so ford could work out the bugs in the 99's....the IRS was one of them...2001's then came out with much improved geometry, etc. then ford didnt release an 02 version, to further work out the kinks of the IRS and retool the factory for the crossover.

the only "problems" i see with this car are:

1. Eaton blower is roots style, meaning that at the upper rpms it wont flow enough cfm past a certain level of hp. an upgrade to centrifugual ala a vortech or procharger would be advantageous. however, roots style blowers mount to the upper intake manifold, so custom work may be needed?

2. For years mustang enthusiasts have begged ford for more power cuz of GM's LS-1. Ford was focused instead on making a better built car overall. right now the fox chasis(1979-prsent) is pretty much as good as its gonna get from the factory without extensive modifications=more money, driving up the cost of the car. up til now, ford has done a pretty good job keeping costs low, but when you upgrade teh tranny, suspension, rear end, interior, exterior, throw in a 6 year old R&D'd engine that has never been used in production before, etc. the cost is invariably going to go up. ESPECIALLY considering this is a mid-generation changeover...the retooling for this car prob. took months.

3. what 2 basically means is that if you're complaining about low level of hp (HAHA!), or the 2k price increase, please learn some economics. for 35k this car WILL outaccelerate a LS-1 vette, WS6, Trans Am, etc with ease. 0-60 is expected to be mid 4's. IF you're complaining that this car is STILL a mustang, yada yada, be happy with having less than 200 hp, cuz you're a moron.

that be it :)

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 07:31 AM

Originally posted by Acilec
Hi Dave,

Yeah man, I fully know that I should have had my ass kicked by these GT's in a 1/4 mile situation, but like I said before It's true and I blame it on two things: 1.) The mustangs were automatic and 2.), the driver sucked. Therefore, racing on the streets is different. No disrespect, but I'm not a liar. I've beaten two. A kill is a kill. But I fully admit that in a realistic 1/4 mile situation with a good driver and manual transmission, I would not stand a chance. Unless I get some more mods :-)

Best regards,

Fin

im still cautious man..nothig personal of course, but...you're talking about a car, even n auto form, that traps over 10mph higher than your own...thats about 8 car lengths..so even if he just stomped on the pedal for a couple seconds, he should have passed you.

either that or it was an auto v6 with GT bages on it..hehe damn v6 ricers. :D

Acilec

02-06-2002, 07:40 AM

Could have been :-)

Hey, I saw your time slip on your page (nice looking car by the way), I'm only off by 0.4 seconds and 3 mph. Not too bad. I know that was stock though. What are you running now?

Fin

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 07:48 AM

Originally posted by Acilec
Could have been :-)

Hey, I saw your time slip on your page (nice looking car by the way), I'm only off by 0.4 seconds and 3 mph. Not too bad. I know that was stock though. What are you running now?

Fin

thanks for the compliment...the car hand't been waxed ina month in that pic..good old Ford clearcoat :D want to take some pics of it now as ive recently Zymoled it and then put on some Gold Class..its blinding in sunlight..haha

dunno yet. ran my friends low to mid 14 second 5.0 the other night and stayed even with him from 50-95 in 3rd gear.

at commerce that translates into a low 15...hehe

that 15.4 came with detonation, had to pull the plugs, clean fuel system, etc...still not sure if #6 is running right yet..may be leaning out slightly. also that 60 foot sucked for my car....so take that 15.4 with a grain of salt :) only timeslip worth posting honestly, the others were mid 15's and up from lack of traction(still running 215's)

on the street though, itlll move :D

getting some DR's when i can afford it...I expect mid to low 14's then if the 5.0 race was any indication of the power i have now.

als ordering a 75 shot, but you didnt hear me say that ;)

Acilec

02-06-2002, 07:56 AM

lol! Nope, didn't hear a thing man :-)

Let us know when you go to the track next and when you get it all fixed up.

Take care,

Fin

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 08:00 AM

Thanks!

i'll be sure to do that...im interested in it as well honestly...i just hope Commerce(my pos track) doesn't hold me back too much like it has before.

huangc2

02-06-2002, 12:19 PM

CB GTS dude I own a celica GTS 6spd and have recently had the pleasure of driving a 02 Mustang GT 5 spd, all I can say is good LAWD!! I use to have the old school asian FOB mentality that American=crap, but after driving and getting on that mustang I was wrong in my ignorant ways, my next ride is going to be a mustang, out of the I4 camp and into American Muscle. This goes to all rice boys who think american is crap, just go and test drive one and I guarantee that torque and rwd will have you smiling and giggling like a little girl.

01MustangGT

02-06-2002, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by huangc2
CB GTS dude I own a celica GTS 6spd and have recently had the pleasure of driving a 02 Mustang GT 5 spd, all I can say is good LAWD!! I use to have the old school asian FOB mentality that American=crap, but after driving and getting on that mustang I was wrong in my ignorant ways, my next ride is going to be a mustang, out of the I4 camp and into American Muscle. This goes to all rice boys who think american is crap, just go and test drive one and I guarantee that torque and rwd will have you smiling and giggling like a little girl.
U damn rite man. Cause my friend, he got a Civic Si. And he is the one who taught me how to drive a stick. When i bought my Stang GT, i don't even know how to drive a stick. He had to drive to the dealer and get me and drive my Stang back home for me. Wat he said to me after drive me home in my new Stang is that he had to get rid of his civic. U can't never feel how fun to drive an American "crap" until u try it.
Way to go Huangc2.

SlasherX

02-06-2002, 09:15 PM

you guys dont have any idea how glad i am to read this :)

thank you for vindicating all my posts on here. :)

huangc2

02-07-2002, 01:32 PM

Well I once was lost and now I am found, I'm not saying to all the celica owners out there to get rid of there celi's but try something different, think outside of the box, push the norms, you might like it. I sure as hell did.

msilvia

02-08-2002, 05:28 PM

350Z will own all. All other sports coupes/sports cars/3500lb pigs to date will be made entirely irrelevant shortly. Thank you nissan.

Flame on!

huangc2

02-11-2002, 05:56 PM

right I guess that it'll own the new evo VII with it's huge NA V8, and it'll own the new SVT 03 SCed Cobra and it'll own the new Supra in 04 new NSX in 04. So many cars are coming out, I'm just going to stick with something that has been proven to go fast for the last 40 yrs.

SlasherX

02-11-2002, 07:38 PM

hehe 40 years of having an aftermarket..gee..must be nice :)

huangc2

02-11-2002, 08:07 PM

Yeah I just can't believe they're going with IRS now, man stangs are 1/4 mile cars not road race cars. When I had the GT it hooked so good, I went to the street races with a dude with a 99 GT convert with 5 spd, it was me my bro and him, I'm like 220 and he's like 240 my bro is like 180, man I have never seen so many cars get beaten by a stock GT, he was pounding LS1 SS's LT1 camaros, 98- cobras and some pre 99 GT's, it was amazing. He did this with all of us in the car. He did try a Ws6 at a 60 mph punch, needless to say we got pulled on, but anything from a stop we raped.

6SPDGTS

02-11-2002, 09:16 PM

The thing I hate about it is the weight. It weighs 3500-3600 lbs. Z06 weighs 3100-3200. Thats a huge difference. This car wont be close to the Z06 but wil be very close to the 350hp regular vette. I think 35k is a fair price for it. I say maybe high 12's stock. We wil see.

huangc2

02-15-2002, 05:31 PM

Z06 also costs 15 grand more than the cobra will.

iNteGraz92

02-15-2002, 06:37 PM

Originally posted by SlasherX

exactly... the only people who say hp/liter, or needing a supercharger, blah blah blah are the ones who lose the race.

you run what you brung.
then hurry up and buy this car and leave the forum :D

and to djm, when you say those import engines don't make as much torque as the mustang....... u know why? cuz it has a freakin SUPERCHARGER. of course a supercharged engine will make more torque than a NA engine.

IMO 390hp/tq from a 4.6L SUPERCHARGED engine is uh... ok.
the only thing i like is the fact that it has a warranty from the factory.

SlasherX

02-15-2002, 07:21 PM

supercharger helps, but torque is directly related to the amunt of displacement an engine has. that is physics.

and why should i leave the forum?

SlasherX

02-15-2002, 08:39 PM

Originally posted by msilvia
350Z will own all. All other sports coupes/sports cars/3500lb pigs to date will be made entirely irrelevant shortly. Thank you nissan.

Flame on!

mid 5 second 0-60's and 280hp out of a tuned engine isn't what i would call anythign special..sorry to break it to you. car's nice but no car is truly the best at everything.

msilvia

02-16-2002, 07:34 PM

Slasher: My last post wasn't completely serious. But you're making a mistake I think if you dismiss the Z as "nothing special". 280hp out of a 6 isn't earth shattering, no, but a sub-14 second car (a *sports* car with a suspension every bit as worthy as it's HP) for $27 is. And that six is far from "tuned" to it's limits. FWIW, it sounds like that ford is going to be a monster too, but for more $$ than the Z. Ford obviously isn't playing around anymore - no one is. I think we're entering a time in automotive history where cars are going to be coming from the factory at a performance level that hasn't been seen since the muscle-car era.

See, the thing with the Z is that it (along with it's coming contemporaries) really will make the cars out now irrelevant. Why in god's name would you ever buy a 200hp RSX for $24k, or a WRX for $25K (tunability aside), or a 220ish hp RSX type R for like $26 or who knows how much when you can buy a 280hp RWD true sports car for just a hair more? It changes the whole equation. What used to be impressive isn't so much anymore.

For example, look at the latest Altima. $24.9k, 1/4 in 14.8 @ 95. The current Mustang GT is $24.1k, 1/4 in 14.7 @ 94.7. These are numbers from the same magazine in the same article. (C&D 11/01) All of a sudden a cushy people-mover sedan is equaling the legendary drag car at its specialty. I'm not saying this to knock the Mustang - but all of a sudden it's not so special anymore when it's not faster than an everyday sedan. The whole performance scene is getting knocked upside down right now, and 2000 cars sometimes just look silly next to 2003 cars. It's a strange time in the automotive world.

Sorry to change the subject, I've just been thinking about all this for a while. It's a very, very good time to have cash in your pocket and be waiting to see what happens. All that consternation people had around here about whether to jump ship on the Celica for the RSX is going to look funny soon.

SlasherX

02-16-2002, 08:26 PM

very nice post..very respectful..two things

1. i agre, the Z car is an exremely WELL BALANCED car..it isn't meant to be used sole yfor drag racing, but for anything you can throw at it, it should do well in. and for the price, its a nice nie car.

2. that magazine time is flawed as all hell..to give you an idea, people in v6's are hitting that 14.7 with I/E and a short shifter, without even an LSD (Thor on V6power). anyone who has looked further will see a good good bit of the 99 up mustang gt's hitting 100mph traps and high 13's. they can also hit 12's with bolt on's. that time is so far off the truth that i can't even imagine who the hell was driving it...cuz they are a TERRIBLE driver.

djm221

02-16-2002, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by iNteGraz92

then hurry up and buy this car and leave the forum :D

and to djm, when you say those import engines don't make as much torque as the mustang....... u know why? cuz it has a freakin SUPERCHARGER. of course a supercharged engine will make more torque than a NA engine.

IMO 390hp/tq from a 4.6L SUPERCHARGED engine is uh... ok.
the only thing i like is the fact that it has a warranty from the factory.

The "arguement" was that there are all these NA engines with new technology that kick ass, yet Ford has to rely on a supercharger to get similar (well, better) numbers. But, they get similar fuel economy and produce similar power, so what's the difference in how they choose to get there. I bet the Ford engine is a hell of alot cheaper than the BMW M5 engine.

Anyway, I am sure the high powered Mustangs give you that giddy girlish laugh when you punch the gas, but there is more to the driving experience than your ass in the seat. At least that is what I think. I like small cars, the lighter the better, that is why the Celica was and still is very appealing to me. Torque is thrilling, but so is agility. And even though you can experience the thrill of straightline speed more often, it still doesn't provide the rush of ripping through turns in a lightweight car.

GageTokes

02-17-2002, 10:14 AM

I'm a former mustang driver .. and personally i wouldn't be posting if I drove a V6.. no matter how many mods you have.. lol.. :) I had a 94 GT, supercharger, cobra intake, straight piped, functional ram air hood, & neons. Nice car but it doesn't compare to the celica for girl attention.. no matter how loud it was. :) -gage

SlasherX

02-17-2002, 11:25 AM

and the funny thing is my v6 would prob whup on your neons-equipped GT-S all day, so STFU.

HilfigerCelica

02-17-2002, 03:36 PM

Dave, I'm gonna kill you for making me like American cars so much. I was the typical Asian too, but my buddy's dad has a Expedition and a F150 and so far those two cars have been very reliable.

If I were to get another car, I just might go for Stang.

SlasherX

02-17-2002, 10:23 PM

you know you'll like it..dont fight it :)

Acilec

02-18-2002, 05:37 AM

Originally posted by djm221

The "arguement" was that there are all these NA engines with new technology that kick ass, yet Ford has to rely on a supercharger to get similar (well, better) numbers. But, they get similar fuel economy and produce similar power, so what's the difference in how they choose to get there. I bet the Ford engine is a hell of alot cheaper than the BMW M5 engine.

Anyway, I am sure the high powered Mustangs give you that giddy girlish laugh when you punch the gas, but there is more to the driving experience than your ass in the seat. At least that is what I think. I like small cars, the lighter the better, that is why the Celica was and still is very appealing to me. Torque is thrilling, but so is agility. And even though you can experience the thrill of straightline speed more often, it still doesn't provide the rush of ripping through turns in a lightweight car.

Those BMW M5 engines are worth every penny as they come directly from the development of their race cars. The M5 stock runs 13.2 -13.5 seconds. My friend has one and that was his first time at the track. That engine is sweet.