OCV thread

[2way]

Dealer, online dealer, eBay, For Sale Forum.........

[GSBoek]

I have some more news on the VVT-i intake gear. The original part number for it was 13050-22011 and it was updated a few years later but still kept the 13050-22011 number.
Called the Toyota parts center here in Tokyo and they said there is now a new update to the VVT-i gear, part number is now 13050-22012. They are bringing it in tomorrow so I should have a few pics after I pick it up.

[2way]

Yes, I believe I mentioned the original update earlier in the thread or in one of the other ones.

[GSBoek]

Yap, I remember we talked about that and how we could be sure it was the updated part dealers were stocking since the number didn't change. This one is good news as there is certainty now that I'm getting the newly updated part

[2way]

It'll be interesting when you dissect one of the other ones. I'm sure you'll be posting pics.

[GSBoek]

I'll be installing this when I'm back home, of course there will be a writeup for it and hopefully this resolves the VVT-i noise issues for good.

New part number:


Camgear front:


Cam side:

[GSBoek]

Got back from Tokyo yesterday and since I still had a day off today before going back to work I did replace the VVT-i camgear with the new updated one. As promised I'm including a short summary for the thread. It's not a dedicated writeup with detailed info, y'all will have to understand.

The solution for both the VVT-i startup rattle AND the idle rattle is to install a new intake cam gear. To recap you will need the updated intake cam gear, part no. in the previous post.

As mentioned I will not go into the details of the installation. What is important is that the new camgear is supposed to come unlocked from the factory. You have to slide the new gear unto the cam, making sure the dowel pin on the camshaft goes into the cavity designed for it and then tighten the bolt. Make sure the cam gear does not rotate in relation to the camshaft until you have finished tightening the bolt. After you finish tightening rotate the cam gear clockwise (when looking at it from the front) to lock it in place). I have provided a pic from the back of the cam gear that gives you a rough idea of what I'm talking about. The angle between the red and blue line is with tha cam gear unlocked. The angle between the yellow and blue line is what you get when you rotate the camgear and lock it in place. The hole will be at a smaller angle in relation to the imaginary line of the camshaft dowel pin. Remember, this picture is from the back side. (larger pic in gallery)



When doing the installation I had a very pleasant coincidence: the timing marks on the timing chain (orange) happened to actually be aligned with the dots on the sprockets what are the odds of that so it made my work easier. I just had to rotate the crank a little counter clockwise to get the cams into TDC position for no.1 cylinder. This is pure coincidence of course, most of the time you will not get this and you will have to mark the chain.





New camgear in place


After everything is back in place it is a good idea to prime the engine to get some oil up in the system. I did it by cranking for a few seconds with the coilpacks unplugged. This will throw codes P1300, P1305, P1310 and P1315 for the iginition coils, which you clear with and OBDII scan tool later after you've plugged the coils back and started the car.

To recap, compare the noises:

VVT-i idle rattle
VVT-i coldstart rattle
VVT-i coldstart rattle gone

[2way]

You must be psyched, Bro!

Now to dissect the bad one

[dragon2003]

well i recently ran a test on the ocv, i pulled the ocv and ran power to it to see what happens when its switched on, when it is on the shaft barely moves, not allowing oil to pass through to adjust the timing. so my timing is off all the time. so i ordered another one which i get friday, and hopefully it fixes the problem.

[01gtsRacer]

http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?t=277933 if someone is having problems with theirs p.m. me

[zaternine]

Hey guys, wondering if some one can help me out here, my wifes car give the 1349 code on her 02 echo, but unlike anyone the car doesnt loose power at all, it doesnt stall, it picks up pretty fast but it sucks gas like a V8! but for a month the light was off, no codes and it still wasted gas and then today the code came up again. I have taken the OCV out and cleaned it and the strainer. Now my question is testing this thing, to engage the OCV i run POS and NEG to the connection. what should happen to indicate if the OCV is good or bad when i run 12v to the OCV while on the car with the engine running, and can i test out of the car if so what should or shouldnt i see? Second if the code is for VVTI malfunction is there something actually like a VVTI solenoid or is that done through the main ECU. any help would be greatly appreciated thanks in advance.

[GSBoek]

If you apply power to the OCV the car should either stall or run rough if it's working properly. If it isn't you won't notice anything. If you take the OCV out and apply power to it you should see the plunger moving.
There is no VVT-i solenoid, it works by oilpressure through the OCV to the camgear. The ECU controls OCV actuation, alternately reversing oil flow to the VVT-i camgear. The oilpressure inside the camgear forces the inner mechanism to change phase relative to the timing chain rotation and that is what changes the valve timing as the cam is either advanced or retarded.

It seems like you have an intermittent problem. For the P1349 code it usually is either the OCV malfuntioning or the VVT-i actuator (the camgear). In the TECH INFO section in the menubar go to the volume 1 repair manual page 334 (DI-123) there's info on that.

[zaternine]

wow great that really helps me out allot time to do some testing. the OCV works then i should most likely replace the VVTI actuator (cam gear) which now involves a timing job ....sounds like fun, thanks for the input i will let you know how it goes.

[BOMtastic]

my bro picked up an 03 vibe gt with 171k on it for $2200 and lift wasnt working, so I just cleaned the lift ocv or w/e its called(the one on the right side of the motor) and it has lift now...woot...probably should clean out the other one too

unfortunatly the whole motor is just filled with sludge...apparently this dude didn't change the oil enough or something, but it seems to be pulling ok for a vibe with 171k on it

great thread!

[01gtsRacer]

Originally Posted by GSBoek

If you apply power to the OCV the car should either stall or run rough if it's working properly. If it isn't you won't notice anything. If you take the OCV out and apply power to it you should see the plunger moving.
There is no VVT-i solenoid, it works by oilpressure through the OCV to the camgear. The ECU controls OCV actuation, alternately reversing oil flow to the VVT-i camgear. The oilpressure inside the camgear forces the inner mechanism to change phase relative to the timing chain rotation and that is what changes the valve timing as the cam is either advanced or retarded.

It seems like you have an intermittent problem. For the P1349 code it usually is either the OCV malfuntioning or the VVT-i actuator (the camgear). In the TECH INFO section in the menubar go to the volume 1 repair manual page 334 (DI-123) there's info on that.

how did you apply power to the ocv?

[PERRYHALL LIFT]

Hey I have a 2000 GT-S and i have the same thing going on with noise, but I also have and idle problem too. When i hear the noise i unplug the OCV, the noise goes away and the car idles fine. do you guys think that a new cam gear will fix this.

[GSBoek]

^In your case it sounds more like the OCV itself is faulty, considering what you say about the idle.

[GSBoek]

2way, here's the dissection for ya. Took me exactly two months to actually get myself to tear it apart. Autopsy of the old camgear points to the lock pin as the culprit of the VVT-i startup and idle rattle. Took it apart on thursday and here are the pics.

Before dissection. All it takes is to remove the 4 pentagonal head bolts.


Next pic is with the cover plate off. As it sits right now is the locked position for startup and idle(you can see the lockpin is recessed). This is the fully retarded cam position. When oil pressure is applied, the internal mechanism (to which the cams bolts) rotates clockwise to the advanced positition.


Next is the inside of the cover plate. You can see the wear the lockpin spring puts on the plate as the cam phase changes from retard to advance. The coverplate, VVT-i housing and timing chain tooth section are fixed together by the 4 bolts and the cam/VVT-i mechanism rotates within them.


Here you can see the lockpin and spring. I'm pushing it up with my finger.


This is the other side of the mechanism, where you can see the lockpin.


Lockpin in the locked position.


Lockpin


This is where the pin locks into: the timing chain sprocket. You can clearly see the area of travel of the VVT-i mechanism from retard to advance.


In this pic you can see what causes the noise. I marked the wear the lockpin made on the sprocket as it attempts to lock at idle, which causes the rattle. Possibly related to a bit of oil pressure loss inside the VVT-i assembly as it wears with time and abuse.


Another angle of the wear.


Hope you enjoyed and hopefully this helps users understand the VVT-i mechanism and the related noises discussed in this thread.

[2way]

Makes great sense to me now! Thanks for the awesome pics! It will, obviously, get progressively worse. As the wear increases at that release point, the more oil pressure it will take to release the lock pin due to the leakage around it.

[GSBoek]

I might dissect the other old camgear I have lying around, still attached to a cam. Will probably find the very same thing on that one too.

[BigEddiem]

Have enjoyed reading this thread and all the replies I have a problem with the VVTLi on my own car which is a 2002 Toyota celica 190 when you push the car upto the 600rpm were the lift is supposed to come in nothing happens.

This problem surfaced about 10 days ago when I accelerated along the motorway on my way to work the engine hit 600rpm and no lift engaged the light came on on the dash.

I took the car to my local main Dealer and they run Diagnostic on the car and informed me that there was a VVTi Oil control malfunction and it needed replacing and they quoted me £700 for the repair.

When I asked about the high cost of the repair I was informed that it was a full days work for a technician.

If any of the members have any other ideas or suggestions as to what may be causing the problem with the lift it would be appreciated

[2way]

That sounds more like a VVTL malfunction, unless you're in limp mode. Clean the VVTL OCV screen and test the VVTL OCV.

[BigEddiem]

Hello.

Thanks for the reply is that the controller on the side of the head to the right on the battery side.

[2way]

Yes. Driver's side is the VVTL OCV.

[GSBoek]

He's in UK so that would be the passenger side Next to the battery is correct.

[BigEddiem]

Thanks for the replies

Have any of you dealt with this problem before had a look at the job of servicing/replacing the VVTLi control does not look to complicated 2to 3hours at the most.
Just can not imagine where the Toyota Garage got there price from for this relativley small job.

Will take your advice and try cleaning the control first is there a way of testing the control to determine if it is working properly and is this a common problem on the Celica.

[BigEddiem]

Hello Guys

Finally got around to removing the OCV for cleaning it was in a right mess badly gunged up have cleaned the housing,filter and OCV also dropped the oil and changed filter could you tell me when the OCV is connected to power should the inner part move.

If it is meant to move this could also be part of the problem I did not see any visible signs of movement and will replace the part before re-assembling.

[2way]

Yes, applying 12V should operate the solenoid.

Plan on some short interval oil changes to clean that engine out.

[BigEddiem]

Hello Guys.

Gave the VVTLI OCV another clean along with the filter added a flushing agent to the engine.
I then run the car for 2hours dropped the oil and changed filter again and now it is back to normal hit 6000rpm and in comes the VVTL what a superb feeling to have your car back to normal and running the way it should.

On another line is there any audio units that are the same size as the one fitted to the Celica I am looking to upgrade to a set which is also an mp3 player have already looked at a few but they are much smaller and there does not appear to be any suitable blanking plates available for the opening.

[2way]

There was a UK store that sold them. But, I forget the name. Don't know about the Euro models... but, the US can do a Scion swap to get MP3 capability. Toyo also sells a plate. Search the Audio Forum.

And plan on another short interval oil change

[bpham7655]

Hello Guys.

I have a question, I got a 2000 Celica GT-S. Everytime when i got up to about 7k RPM, the engine check light poped up. Then i plus the qucik check in and it showed (P1693 [OCV Malfunction]). I did test 2 solenoids and both of them are still working. So what is the problem with my car ???
Thanks

[2way]

Did you clean the VVTL OCV screen?

[hombredelassrta]

i could not get my timing ocv out even with the bolt off. and suggestions?

[GSBoek]

The OCV itself won't come out if you don't remove the breather tube. The trick is to loosen the clamp that connects the oil breather tube to the block (it's located below the IM and a little tough to get to), then loosen the bolt that holds the breather and dipstick tubes to the manifold and removing the two nuts on the valvecover in order to move the breather tube away so that you can clear the OCV.

[hombredelassrta]

aaah ok. it was a while since i did it and couldnt recall if the tube was in the way. the 03+ IM actually hits the ocv when trying to remove it. i gave the IM a real good tub and it came off but took a long time

[SportsM.Neil]

I have a similar problem, worse i think actually and wont be fixed the same way as you have above.

Do any of you know what i should do? someone suggested taking the cam cover off and checking the valve clearances.. does anyone know how i do that?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=mMf4YsDQtR0

[matrix02]

2000 Celica GT 1110k miles stick shift

All my oil I just put in magically disappeared. Took 4 quarts to fill it back up. Anyway before I found this out(no warning light) I took one 10-15 minute highway run averaging 50MPH with no big issue, just slight tractor effect. Then went up to 5k+ RPMs and the TRACTOR was born! Oil helped, but it now has start up rattle and tractor idle and above 2.5k RPM sounds a little to scary to risk. Car ran great before this happened. No noise at all.

From reading this VERY good thread I'm thinking to replace that gear part and switch to Syth and clean OCV. Am I on track?

[GSBoek]

^ In your case I think the problem might be worse than just the OCV issue. Typically the OCV-related tractor noise goes away completely above 2K rpm, it only makes the noise at idle and low rpm when the timing is fully retarded.

[shadytunerGTS]

So what is this newly revised VVTi intake cam supposed to do? I know it gets rid of the noise, but is it supposed to last longer without wearing out? I should probably get a new one while I'm rebuilding my head, right?

[shadytunerGTS]

bump

[GSBoek]

Yes and yes. The updated part was part of a TSB to quell VVT-i related noises. Since you're rebuilding the head it's a good idea to get a new one, as the old one will have undoubtedly worn around the lock pin.

[Keeper818]

VVT-i/OCV malfunction. HELP!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I rebuild my engine with stronger internals(you can see the list in my signature).
When all was done and i start the car i notice valve noise and engine check light was up. My mechanic said it is vvti sprocket couse that was the only thing i didn't change of timing chain components.
So i bought new ungraded VVTi spocket, change it, but still the same tractor noise and engine check light comes up after while.
I read the thread about OCV isue on this site, so i try disconnecting the OCV plug while engine was running and that didnt make any difference.
I bought new OCV, installed it. NO DIFFERENCE, stil the same tractor noise!
I went to test ecu with obd tester. The codes come up P13749 - VVTi System Malfunction and P1656 - OCV Circuit Malfunction.
The guy, who tested my car pointed at OCV valve as he recons that is the problem.
I did apply 12v to OCV terminals and that didn't do anything, ired that engine suppose to stall. but that didn't happen. I taked OCV out from the car and tested again, the pluger inside is moving forward when 12v is applied.
My head is fried at the moment. Anyone have any idea what it could couse it?
PLEASE HELP!

[Orijinalx]

okay, so i had a reman. engine put in and it's been giving me p1349 code. I couldnt get to the OCV timing filter, but managed to get the LIFT OCV housing. when i opened it i knew something was different, and it seems the shop that reassembled my engine put the filter in backwards?
Your picture:


And this is what i saw when i opened mine:





could that be the reason i'm getting a CEL? And i tried to take it out, it doesn't move...

[GSBoek]

Originally Posted by Keeper818

VVT-i/OCV malfunction. HELP!

Did you install the new camgear correcty, that is in the unlocked position and then turned it to lock it once it had been torqued correctly to the cam? Did you remove the filter to see if there's any blockage?

Originally Posted by Orijinalx

could that be the reason i'm getting a CEL? And i tried to take it out, it doesn't move...

The P1349 is a code for the VVT-i side, not the VVTL-i side. You will need to check the timing filter also, as the CEL may not be related to the the filter of the Lift side installed incorrectly.

Now, for the Lift filter, you will need to find a way to get it out. My guess is they installed it backwards and hammered it in when it didn't seem to fit the OCV housing. Try grabbing it with a needle nose plier or something and wiggle it out.

[Proximity]

What is the actual cleaning procedure? What do I use to clean it? I saw someone mention diesel, does that mean to just head to the gas station and get a bi of diesel fuel?

Also, do you need to remove the OCV to take the housing off?

[GSBoek]

Diesel is only for the timing OCV filter as the surround for it is plastic. For the lift OCV filter you can use carb cleaner, the whole thing is metal. OCV can come off with the housing. You'd have to clean the housing to just in case so you'd have to remove the OCV too.

[Proximity]

Should I be able to get carb cleaner at like autozone or a hardware store?

[GSBoek]

Just though I'd let you guys know that I took apart the new timing gear and it too shows wear at the lockpin release, after almost a year of driving. The wear is much less than the old ones though and so far no noises. They might come eventually as it continues to wear at the release point. Pics to follow later.

[2way]

I tend to think it may be just slightly too low an oil pressure. A point where there is just barely enough pressure to release the pin and it rattles back & forth, between release & locked. Or maybe wearing on the VVT vanes?

[GSBoek]

I'm siding with the slightly low oil pressure theory too, considering most of the miles on the new gear were on the old oil pump before I rebuilt recently. With the new oil pump I'm hoping for the better.