Dyno results: Injen CAI vs. AEM CAI

Jesse IL · 05-30-2002, 10:53 PM

I've had these for a while but haven't posted them. I bought an Injen 3rd gen CAI to compare with my AEM CAI. My car also has a TRD exhaust. I dynoed the car stock a while back as well. The same dyno was used both times as well as the same tire inflation pressure. This is how I tested the car to make sure the Injen and AEM results would compare fairly. I installed the Injen on a Friday night along with the TRD exhaust. I reset the ECU and cleaned the MAF sensor. The Injen was run about 200 miles total before it was tested, a mix of street, highway, and two days at the track. The best run was the morning after installing the intake/exhaust 14.8@98.95mph. I noticed with the Injen a massive lack of low end power compared with the AEM. The car also was hard to drive smoothly away from lights comparitively and had a big bog at about 4600 rpm under part throttle. You can see in the first dyno run that the Injen/TRD combo is killing the stock setup up top but is losing tons of power down low. The Injen HP line is red and torque line is green, stock HP line is dark blue and torque line is light blue.

On Wednesday night after dtnoing the Injen setup, I removed it and reinstalled the AEM, resetting the ECU again. The car was driven about 50 miles before it was run on Thursday at the dyno. The low end power and drivability off idle picked right back up and the part throttle bog disappeared. The first graph shows the AEM/TRD combo vs. stock (AEM HP=dark blue, torque=light blue stock HP=red, torque=green) As you can see, the low end power loss is significantly less than with the Injen.

Now this last graph shows the AEM/TRD vs. Injen/TRD This is where I was surprised. The Injen olny beat out the AEM by one peak HP. And the Injen only passed the AEM after 7300 rpm. Not only that, but the AEM absolutely killed the Injen down low. (In this graph AEM HP=dark blue, torque=light blue Injen HP=red, torque=green)

After having both intakes in my car, I can say that the AEM is a far better choice for street use. The fitment of the intake is far better, and there are no holes or stumbles in the powerband. That isn't to say that the Injen may not have some promise or does not have good aspects. It may be possible to tune the Injen with a S-AFC to make more top end power, because that seems to be where its powerband is biased. Also, the Injen puts the filter in a far better location than the AEM. The Injen has a sharp bend at the end which causes the filter to sit nearly vertical and up and out of the airstream coming into the front bumper. This is beneficial in two ways. First, the filter isn't constantly being bombarded with road debris. Second, I think that in real world use, the AEM may suffer a power loss at high speeds. Its filter is located right in the air stream entering the bumper. When you move air at speed past the end of a pipe, you have a pressure drop at the end of the pipe. At high speeds, there is alot of airflow through the front end, especially with ny TRD bumper that has a large gap between the plastics and the bumper. I am thinking of making a fiberglass ram air box to mount the AEM in that is fed by the opening in the front bumper.

So I hope this all was enlightening to everyone. More stuff can be found at my site http://www.ameritech.net/users/trdcelica/celica.htm

Mafiesto · 05-30-2002, 11:03 PM

Damn, that was informative. Killer post man.

Jesse IL · 05-30-2002, 11:08 PM

Thanks. One thing I forgot. My power readings were down a bit compared with what I expected. Since the Celica has a very adaptive ECU, I think the car will over time learn itself to higher power. I felt that resetting the ECU shortly before dynoing the car was the only way to make the test fair. Sport Compact Car found that their WRX lost a bit of power after resetting the ECU.

revelation2k · 05-30-2002, 11:12 PM

mad props on some great info

GT-S Celica · 05-30-2002, 11:20 PM

nice post jesse. very helpful.

CelicaLicious · 05-31-2002, 12:23 AM

wow.. nice post!!

why are the torque curves so jumpy?

Spec GTS · 05-31-2002, 03:41 AM

very informative post, bravo. glad i got the aem instead

X-EVIL-X · 05-31-2002, 06:49 AM

very interesting post.
i would think different cars perform differently also but this is a good way to see.
larryd also compaired all of them and didn't loose that much...
he also made 175hp with the injen and the torque numbers were pretty close to the same as the aem.
you should of went to the dyno, made a few runs with one and swithed it right than and made some more runs.
i want to try this out...

ToJo · 05-31-2002, 08:50 AM

I don't notice this low end lack of power at all. Check mine out.
This is a warm run and an overheated run with the CAI. STOCK exhaust.

At 4000 rpm, where your run shows 75, I'm showing about 86. On either run.

Not to mention my peak HP numbers.

So keeping in mind that this is different dyno, different car, etc. I have some questions:

1. Did my run post higher numbers because I let my ECU run with the CAI for weeks before dyno?

2. Is the TRD Exhaust hurting the performance down low?

3. Is the TRD Exhaust even worth the money?

I think it's tough to say that the AEM is better for street use when what you in fact dyno'd was the AEM+Exhaust combo. Not simply CAI vs CAI.

Regardless...I won't be running out to buy an exhaust anytime soon.

GTS LAID · 05-31-2002, 09:04 AM

so AEM + exhaust is better down low...

it might have something to do with the fact that you DO need a bit of backpressure low down to make some torque... you dont need much.. but whatever you need i guess has been taken away by a freer flowing exhaust.

SloGTS · 05-31-2002, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ToJo
I don't notice this low end lack of power at all. Check mine out.
This is a warm run and an overheated run with the CAI. STOCK exhaust.

At 4000 rpm, where your run shows 75, I'm showing about 86. On either run.

Not to mention my peak HP numbers.

So keeping in mind that this is different dyno, different car, etc. I have some questions:

1. Did my run post higher numbers because I let my ECU run with the CAI for weeks before dyno?

2. Is the TRD Exhaust hurting the performance down low?

3. Is the TRD Exhaust even worth the money?

I think it's tough to say that the AEM is better for street use when what you in fact dyno'd was the AEM+Exhaust combo. Not simply CAI vs CAI.

Regardless...I won't be running out to buy an exhaust anytime soon.

Is it me or did you run both your runs with the CAI, if so then what are you comparing. warm engine vs hot. if im wrong then my bad. but your run should be stock air box at a particular engine temp vs CAI w/ the same engine temp to see and particular gains or losses in your RPM range...

05-31-2002, 09:56 AM

Very Useful post Jesse.

I've heard ppl say AEM does provide more low end gain and Injen up high end.

TeeAREdee · 05-31-2002, 10:29 AM

nice...makes me glad I got the AEM. I was almost regretting it at one point. I have the same setup AEM/TRD.

good post!

DC · 05-31-2002, 10:45 AM

I don't know how long the intakes were on the car before thte dyno, but I do have to say that it definately makes a difference after the ECU has "learned." I thought the whole learning thing was a bunch of bologne, but it really does make a difference, particularly with the injen. The injen (3rd jen that is) is really rough until the engine learns and smoothes it out. Im not sure what the effect is on power, but after learning the car runs a lot smoother.

I used to have the aem intake as well, and just from driving experiences I have to say that the injen makes better power when you want to go fast. I think that the peak power is definately better than the AEM, how much I cant say, but it is noticeable to me just from driving. It is easier to stay in lift thats for sure.

As far as low end power, I cant really praise either. The celica just doesnt have much in that department and either intake is going to do a whole lot for our car. When I put on the aem, I didnt really notice a whole world a difference and the same with the injen.

When it comes down to it, I'm glad I ended up with the Injen, even though it does require cutting the ecu pipe. I think that the injen is a good match for our car by giving IMO the max possible peak horsepower, which is all our car's got going for it anyway.

static · 05-31-2002, 10:51 AM

Awesome post Jesse.

For those of you that don't think the TRD Exhaust is a good investment... see my dyno results. These are a good idea of performance gains before and after adding the TRD exhaust. Note to all the doubters.. weather/temp were practically the same during my dyno runs:

http://www.newcelica.org/other/dyno/static/dyno2.jpg

ToJo · 05-31-2002, 12:23 PM

Slo: You're right...they're both INJEN CAI runs with stock exhaust.
I'm comparing my low end curve to Jesse's low end INJEN curve and find mine is way better. No low end power loss.

SO it looks like the TRD exhaust is what's causing the low end loss to the INJEN intake. Maybe AEM optimised their intake to work well with an aftermarket exhaust while INJEN optimised their for best stock exhaust performance. I don't know. But there's definitely no low end power loss with INJEN+Stock exhaust.

Lord Banshee · 05-31-2002, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ToJo
Slo: You're right...they're both INJEN CAI runs with stock exhaust.
I'm comparing my low end curve to Jesse's low end INJEN curve and find mine is way better. No low end power loss.

SO it looks like the TRD exhaust is what's causing the low end loss to the INJEN intake. Maybe AEM optimised their intake to work well with an aftermarket exhaust while INJEN optimised their for best stock exhaust performance. I don't know. But there's definitely no low end power loss with INJEN+Stock exhaust.

is this saying i will lose power for paying 600 dollars for an exhaust? if so i will keep stock exhaust.

and save that 600 dollars toward rims or something...

05-31-2002, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by static
Awesome post Jesse.

For those of you that don't think the TRD Exhaust is a good investment... see my dyno results. These are a good idea of performance gains before and after adding the TRD exhaust. Note to all the doubters.. weather/temp were practically the same during my dyno runs:

http://www.newcelica.org/other/dyno/static/dyno2.jpg

Static,

From your dyno, you gained almost 8HP with TRD... taht is impressive... i wonder how much I gained with INJEN/BLITZ combo..

RPICelica · 05-31-2002, 01:47 PM

After reading that post, I have a couple of questions. (Good Post by the way)

Those of us who are driving a GT (meaning we have no liftor course) would the injen be better? I thought I was sold on buying an injen but I have heard a lot of talk lately about the injen only producing power at high rpms. Since I peak out at 7k rpms would the AEM be a better buy?

static · 05-31-2002, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CelicaNamja79

Static,

From your dyno, you gained almost 8HP with TRD... taht is impressive... i wonder how much I gained with INJEN/BLITZ combo..

yeah.. I was very impressed myself... But you can feel it too.. the car seems to keep power up so much better between shifts.. its hard to explain.. but easy to feel..

05-31-2002, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RPICelica
After reading that post, I have a couple of questions. (Good Post by the way)

Those of us who are driving a GT (meaning we have no liftor course) would the injen be better? I thought I was sold on buying an injen but I have heard a lot of talk lately about the injen only producing power at high rpms. Since I peak out at 7k rpms would the AEM be a better buy?

I got an Injen and it seems fine with me...I felt the gain right away...now yes AEM has been proven that it does provide better low end HP... It is totally up to you though. I like Injen as far as looks go..Prices are almost same...

ToJo · 05-31-2002, 03:21 PM

Banshee: All I'm saying is that I'm at 170 with stock exhaust.
Unless I see a dyno with intake/exhaust giving about 178 then I'm not dishing out the bucks. There are plenty of other mods to deal with (flywheel/clutch/lsd come to mind)

WAR · 05-31-2002, 03:31 PM

ok here is larryd's from the dyno section of this sight. the only difference is that he was running a TRM exhaust and that he had the AEM tuned with the S-AFC for more HP, the injen did not have the S-AFC.

The injen made more HP and more torqe and over all was a better performer. I'm wondering what is going on with this because I was sold on the injen after I saw this but now I'm ?? it.

Also I have a question about the AEM, I was one on a GT and they had to cut part of the wheel well to fit it in. Does the AEM CAI need that for the GT-S?

Jesse IL · 05-31-2002, 03:42 PM

Keep in mind that it is only fair to compare cars with the ECU recently reset. Running the car for a long time will give the ECU a chance to learn and the car will most likely show a gain in power. That's why I tested the intakes the way I did. As a note, Static ran his car on the same dyno that I did. Is his car really making 5 more peak HP that mine is with the same setup? Most likely not, but he had been running that ECU without being reset for many months. There are also many ways to make dynos inconsistent, which is why I used the same dyno, at times that were as close together as possible (to minimize differences in weather). Also, the SAE correction factors used are only accurate over a very small range from standard atmospheric pressure. I tried as hard as I could to remove any possible bias from the tests. To be perfectly honest, the Injen had more miles on it when tested and the first test day was a few degrees cooler but the humidity was down about 15% compared to the second day.

EDIT: I suppose it also would be informative to test a setup that had been on your car a long time, install the different intake and dyno that a few months later, trying to make the weather conditions as similar as possible on the two days.

WAR · 05-31-2002, 03:50 PM

JesseIL: can you answer my AEM install question above?

Thanks,

Jesse IL · 05-31-2002, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by WAR
JesseIL: can you answer my AEM install question above?

Thanks,

Hehe...sorry. Yes you do need to cut out a small bit of the fender well for both the Injen and AEM CAI's on a GT-S. This will be necessary with any CAI since you need a way to get the pipe through to the fender well where the filter is located.

Raymund · 05-31-2002, 04:08 PM

good job, thx

tripnotic · 05-31-2002, 04:13 PM

The most surprising about the INjen Cai, that someone on this site with only a Injen CAI can hit 14.3-14.4. I forgot who it was that was on this site but he has a timeslip and video for it.

Lord Banshee · 05-31-2002, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripnotic
The most surprising about the INjen Cai, that someone on this site with only a Injen CAI can hit 14.3-14.4. I forgot who it was that was on this site but he has a timeslip and video for it.

and that must be the freak GTS or a really good driver.

we all know dark gt is the freak GT lol..... damn it why can't all our cars be freaks

inline4 · 08-28-2002, 01:15 PM

because if all our cars were freaks there wouldn't be any freaks to call freaks... and we would all be original. But than there would still be freaks that hit 13's!.... or something.

gtsmonkee · 08-29-2002, 02:12 AM

so hmm track wise? injen is better or aem with the trd ext. exhaust... dang im still confused

oh yeah...Jesse. do you have the time slip for your aem/trd combo?

Jesse IL · 08-29-2002, 10:36 AM

Damn, reviving the old school threads. No, I have never taken my car to the track with the AEM/TRD combo.

DominicanLou · 08-29-2002, 11:09 AM

I think it was micronrice who hit those low-mid 14s.

Jesse IL · 08-29-2002, 02:58 PM

There have been people with AEM intakes who have hit 14.4 or maybe even 14.3. To get that low, all they were doing was unbolting the exhaust and trying to remove weight from the car. Next time I am at the strip I will be running with the TRD exhaust removed.

inline4 · 08-29-2002, 05:56 PM

This thread deserves to be brought back up.... it's like... kool and informative.

outhouse · 08-29-2002, 07:13 PM

1rst dont kid yourself about exhuast There is a very noticable difference with the TRD I can feel allot of power and it is definatly worth the money hand's down the #2 mod that should be done. The first is a CAI far the best bang for the buck.

Both AEM and Injen are good products and a dyno is hard to test and get decent results as noted above. As far as the @ss gauge ive heard from people [many] who have had both and 99% say they cannot tell the difference, as well I have not heard one post saying I lost track time because I went too AEM from Injen.

I give AEM the slight advantage for one reason CARB legal to smog saweeeet

byebyebaby · 08-30-2002, 09:43 AM

Very interesting that for the GT things are reversed....Injen made better HP over all, with AEM only beat injen at the peak value by a hair...

**larryd** · 08-31-2002, 08:51 PM

the only thing that can really be said here guys is every car. every setup, is going to yeild slightly different results..

you can see clearly on mine that Injen definitely made more power all throughout the curve.. I explained it all when I got that intake along the lines of this..

AEM definitely has a better bottom end, I felt the torque difference with the AEM though the dyno didnt really show it, but the Injen just pulled up top like there was no tomorrow.. When I first put on the Injen I remember saying to myself I cant wait to go to the dyno and get this overwith so I can put my AEM back on and be done with it.. WELL DAMN.. I got to the dyno and holy hell.. the #s spoke for themselves and the car pullign isnanely up top did me in.. I coulda caredless about torque as all I wanted was top end power from 6-8300.

Also another thing, I had the AEM on the car for a while. I dynoed it, and then the very next day I took the Injen to the dyno so if anything the ECU didnt adjust to the Injen and it coulda very well made even more power.. Both dynos were SAE corrected to be the same conditions on the same gas etc etc etc.. nothing else changed other then swapping intakes..

one last thing.. you guys are putting way to much emphasis on the dynos.. both intakes kick butt.. Im an Injen sales man and I wont tell you not to get AEM cuz its a good intake.. A race will not be determined by one person havingt the AEM and one person have the INJEN.. its not that much of a difference.. good luck in your decisions and remember if you do choose Injen I do sell them here on the site for a great price....

2002GT_Celica · 08-31-2002, 10:31 PM

Well, that does it, I am sold on the AEM CAI. I need as much power down low as possible since I have an auto.

inline4 · 08-31-2002, 11:19 PM

Yeah but AEM doesn't make intake's for autos... Maybe you can get it to fit somehow?

**larryd** · 08-31-2002, 11:57 PM

xactly.. last i heard they are working on it but the AEM doesnt fit an auto.. thats thier one big downfall

FL Honda Stompr · 09-01-2002, 05:37 PM

climate plays an enormous role in performance, you may have dynoed in good weather thus giving you more hp on the dyno, while he may have dynoed in humid hot weather giving him a much lower reading, TRD exhaust gives the best gains of any exhause on the market.

**larryd** · 09-01-2002, 08:02 PM

climate has nothing to do with dynos when they are SAE corrected.. SAE puts all dynos at standard temperature adn elevation so they can be compared

JaxCD · 09-03-2002, 07:53 AM

nice post for people who can not decide what to get injen or aem

Jesse IL · 09-03-2002, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by larryd
climate has nothing to do with dynos when they are SAE corrected.. SAE puts all dynos at standard temperature adn elevation so they can be compared

This isn't quite right. The dyno correction factors are only valid over a very small range from "standard atmospheric conditions". Also, you are depending on the dyno operator/shop setting up the thing correctly and inputing the humidity (which has to be done every run).

In hindsight, my only regret about this test was that I was using a 3rd gen Injen CAI, not the 2nd gen that Larry used in his test. It is rumored that the 2nd gen made more power. My other slight concern is that there may have been a manufacturing defect with my Injen. My car had major low RPM driveability problems with the Injen intake, which all cleared up immediately after reinstalling the AEM. All I can say is that I went through as much trouble as I could to ensure that the two tests were as fair as possible and that as many variables as possible were eliminated.

JaxCD · 09-03-2002, 08:16 AM

but u would go with aem?

Jesse IL · 09-03-2002, 08:28 AM

Over the currently available Injen (3rd gen)...every day.

inline4 · 09-04-2002, 02:17 AM

I'm going to get an injen, and put AEM stickers on it. Then get a CARB number so I'll be able to pass visual inpections from the law and emissions.

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05-30-2002, 10:53 PM	#1
Jesse IL GT2871R Inside Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 17,993 iTrader: (11)	Dyno results: Injen CAI vs. AEM CAI I've had these for a while but haven't posted them. I bought an Injen 3rd gen CAI to compare with my AEM CAI. My car also has a TRD exhaust. I dynoed the car stock a while back as well. The same dyno was used both times as well as the same tire inflation pressure. This is how I tested the car to make sure the Injen and AEM results would compare fairly. I installed the Injen on a Friday night along with the TRD exhaust. I reset the ECU and cleaned the MAF sensor. The Injen was run about 200 miles total before it was tested, a mix of street, highway, and two days at the track. The best run was the morning after installing the intake/exhaust 14.8@98.95mph. I noticed with the Injen a massive lack of low end power compared with the AEM. The car also was hard to drive smoothly away from lights comparitively and had a big bog at about 4600 rpm under part throttle. You can see in the first dyno run that the Injen/TRD combo is killing the stock setup up top but is losing tons of power down low. The Injen HP line is red and torque line is green, stock HP line is dark blue and torque line is light blue. On Wednesday night after dtnoing the Injen setup, I removed it and reinstalled the AEM, resetting the ECU again. The car was driven about 50 miles before it was run on Thursday at the dyno. The low end power and drivability off idle picked right back up and the part throttle bog disappeared. The first graph shows the AEM/TRD combo vs. stock (AEM HP=dark blue, torque=light blue stock HP=red, torque=green) As you can see, the low end power loss is significantly less than with the Injen. Now this last graph shows the AEM/TRD vs. Injen/TRD This is where I was surprised. The Injen olny beat out the AEM by one peak HP. And the Injen only passed the AEM after 7300 rpm. Not only that, but the AEM absolutely killed the Injen down low. (In this graph AEM HP=dark blue, torque=light blue Injen HP=red, torque=green) After having both intakes in my car, I can say that the AEM is a far better choice for street use. The fitment of the intake is far better, and there are no holes or stumbles in the powerband. That isn't to say that the Injen may not have some promise or does not have good aspects. It may be possible to tune the Injen with a S-AFC to make more top end power, because that seems to be where its powerband is biased. Also, the Injen puts the filter in a far better location than the AEM. The Injen has a sharp bend at the end which causes the filter to sit nearly vertical and up and out of the airstream coming into the front bumper. This is beneficial in two ways. First, the filter isn't constantly being bombarded with road debris. Second, I think that in real world use, the AEM may suffer a power loss at high speeds. Its filter is located right in the air stream entering the bumper. When you move air at speed past the end of a pipe, you have a pressure drop at the end of the pipe. At high speeds, there is alot of airflow through the front end, especially with ny TRD bumper that has a large gap between the plastics and the bumper. I am thinking of making a fiberglass ram air box to mount the AEM in that is fed by the opening in the front bumper. So I hope this all was enlightening to everyone. More stuff can be found at my site http://www.ameritech.net/users/trdcelica/celica.htm

05-30-2002, 11:08 PM	#3
Jesse IL GT2871R Inside Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 17,993 iTrader: (11)	Thanks. One thing I forgot. My power readings were down a bit compared with what I expected. Since the Celica has a very adaptive ECU, I think the car will over time learn itself to higher power. I felt that resetting the ECU shortly before dynoing the car was the only way to make the test fair. Sport Compact Car found that their WRX lost a bit of power after resetting the ECU. __________________

05-30-2002, 11:12 PM	#4
revelation2k Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 93 iTrader: (0)	mad props on some great info __________________ 2001 Celica GTS 6spd best 1/4: 14.7@93 mph

05-30-2002, 11:03 PM	#2
Mafiesto Registered User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Not anywhere that concerns you Posts: 500 iTrader: (0)	Damn, that was informative. Killer post man. __________________ 07 Red Tacoma SR5 06 Honda CBR 1000RR 94 Honda Civic CX H/B (Trade in Process)

05-30-2002, 11:20 PM	#5
GT-S Celica F22 Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: La Crescenta, California Posts: 2,341 iTrader: (0)	nice post jesse. very helpful. __________________ Steven

05-31-2002, 12:23 AM	#6
CelicaLicious Foofy car Driver Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,854 iTrader: (0)	wow.. nice post!! why are the torque curves so jumpy? __________________ 2004 Suzuki GSX-R 1992 Mazda Miata in the works

05-31-2002, 03:41 AM	#7
Spec GTS celicas are trouble! Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Northridge, CA Posts: 842 iTrader: (0)	very informative post, bravo. glad i got the aem instead __________________

05-31-2002, 06:49 AM	#8
X-EVIL-X i like boobs Join Date: May 2001 Location: AZ,Phoenix Posts: 6,697 iTrader: (10)	very interesting post. i would think different cars perform differently also but this is a good way to see. larryd also compaired all of them and didn't loose that much... he also made 175hp with the injen and the torque numbers were pretty close to the same as the aem. you should of went to the dyno, made a few runs with one and swithed it right than and made some more runs. i want to try this out... __________________

05-31-2002, 08:50 AM	#9
ToJo Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 125 iTrader: (0)	I don't notice this low end lack of power at all. Check mine out. This is a warm run and an overheated run with the CAI. STOCK exhaust. At 4000 rpm, where your run shows 75, I'm showing about 86. On either run. Not to mention my peak HP numbers. So keeping in mind that this is different dyno, different car, etc. I have some questions: 1. Did my run post higher numbers because I let my ECU run with the CAI for weeks before dyno? 2. Is the TRD Exhaust hurting the performance down low? 3. Is the TRD Exhaust even worth the money? I think it's tough to say that the AEM is better for street use when what you in fact dyno'd was the AEM+Exhaust combo. Not simply CAI vs CAI. Regardless...I won't be running out to buy an exhaust anytime soon. __________________ 2002 Spectra Blue Mica GTS INJEN CAI TWM Short Shifter

05-31-2002, 09:04 AM	#10
GTS LAID CARPEPM - Seize the Night Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Manalapan, NJ Posts: 4,089 iTrader: (0)	so AEM + exhaust is better down low... it might have something to do with the fact that you DO need a bit of backpressure low down to make some torque... you dont need much.. but whatever you need i guess has been taken away by a freer flowing exhaust. __________________ newcelica.org member number 231

05-31-2002, 09:56 AM	#12
CelicaNamja79 Posts: n/a	Very Useful post Jesse. I've heard ppl say AEM does provide more low end gain and Injen up high end.

05-31-2002, 10:29 AM	#13
TeeAREdee Gaybie™ Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: S. Cali Posts: 250 iTrader: (0)	nice...makes me glad I got the AEM. I was almost regretting it at one point. I have the same setup AEM/TRD. good post! __________________

05-31-2002, 10:45 AM	#14
DC Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 132 iTrader: (0)	I don't know how long the intakes were on the car before thte dyno, but I do have to say that it definately makes a difference after the ECU has "learned." I thought the whole learning thing was a bunch of bologne, but it really does make a difference, particularly with the injen. The injen (3rd jen that is) is really rough until the engine learns and smoothes it out. Im not sure what the effect is on power, but after learning the car runs a lot smoother. I used to have the aem intake as well, and just from driving experiences I have to say that the injen makes better power when you want to go fast. I think that the peak power is definately better than the AEM, how much I cant say, but it is noticeable to me just from driving. It is easier to stay in lift thats for sure. As far as low end power, I cant really praise either. The celica just doesnt have much in that department and either intake is going to do a whole lot for our car. When I put on the aem, I didnt really notice a whole world a difference and the same with the injen. When it comes down to it, I'm glad I ended up with the Injen, even though it does require cutting the ecu pipe. I think that the injen is a good match for our car by giving IMO the max possible peak horsepower, which is all our car's got going for it anyway. __________________ Current Car: 2002 Honda S2000 Old Car: 2000 Toyota Celica GT-S 6 Speed *SOLD* AEM CAI TRD Exhaust TRD Springs KYB AGX Shocks KumoSport Direct Shift Kit

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05-31-2002, 10:51 AM	#15
static Schnell! Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Wheeling, IL Posts: 2,994 iTrader: (0)	Awesome post Jesse. For those of you that don't think the TRD Exhaust is a good investment... see my dyno results. These are a good idea of performance gains before and after adding the TRD exhaust. Note to all the doubters.. weather/temp were practically the same during my dyno runs: http://www.newcelica.org/other/dyno/static/dyno2.jpg __________________ S4 - Stage 2+

05-31-2002, 12:23 PM	#16
ToJo Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 125 iTrader: (0)	Slo: You're right...they're both INJEN CAI runs with stock exhaust. I'm comparing my low end curve to Jesse's low end INJEN curve and find mine is way better. No low end power loss. SO it looks like the TRD exhaust is what's causing the low end loss to the INJEN intake. Maybe AEM optimised their intake to work well with an aftermarket exhaust while INJEN optimised their for best stock exhaust performance. I don't know. But there's definitely no low end power loss with INJEN+Stock exhaust. __________________ 2002 Spectra Blue Mica GTS INJEN CAI TWM Short Shifter

05-31-2002, 01:47 PM	#19
RPICelica Junior Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 46 iTrader: (0)	After reading that post, I have a couple of questions. (Good Post by the way) Those of us who are driving a GT (meaning we have no liftor course) would the injen be better? I thought I was sold on buying an injen but I have heard a lot of talk lately about the injen only producing power at high rpms. Since I peak out at 7k rpms would the AEM be a better buy? __________________ 2000 Spec Blue Auto GT Installed: Injen RD CAI, AEM Pulley, S2000 Aentenna, Euro Clear Corners, Philips BlueVision lows and fogs. Coming: Redded out tails, Borla Exhaust, HS Header

05-31-2002, 03:21 PM	#22
ToJo Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 125 iTrader: (0)	Banshee: All I'm saying is that I'm at 170 with stock exhaust. Unless I see a dyno with intake/exhaust giving about 178 then I'm not dishing out the bucks. There are plenty of other mods to deal with (flywheel/clutch/lsd come to mind) __________________ 2002 Spectra Blue Mica GTS INJEN CAI TWM Short Shifter

05-31-2002, 03:31 PM	#23
WAR All Spyder Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Calgary Posts: 1,145 iTrader: (0)	ok here is larryd's from the dyno section of this sight. the only difference is that he was running a TRM exhaust and that he had the AEM tuned with the S-AFC for more HP, the injen did not have the S-AFC. The injen made more HP and more torqe and over all was a better performer. I'm wondering what is going on with this because I was sold on the injen after I saw this but now I'm ?? it. Also I have a question about the AEM, I was one on a GT and they had to cut part of the wheel well to fit it in. Does the AEM CAI need that for the GT-S? __________________ WAR '00 MR2 Spyder (extremely moded) '00 GT-S Carbon Blue, Gone but not forgotten

05-31-2002, 03:42 PM	#24
Jesse IL GT2871R Inside Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 17,993 iTrader: (11)	Keep in mind that it is only fair to compare cars with the ECU recently reset. Running the car for a long time will give the ECU a chance to learn and the car will most likely show a gain in power. That's why I tested the intakes the way I did. As a note, Static ran his car on the same dyno that I did. Is his car really making 5 more peak HP that mine is with the same setup? Most likely not, but he had been running that ECU without being reset for many months. There are also many ways to make dynos inconsistent, which is why I used the same dyno, at times that were as close together as possible (to minimize differences in weather). Also, the SAE correction factors used are only accurate over a very small range from standard atmospheric pressure. I tried as hard as I could to remove any possible bias from the tests. To be perfectly honest, the Injen had more miles on it when tested and the first test day was a few degrees cooler but the humidity was down about 15% compared to the second day. EDIT: I suppose it also would be informative to test a setup that had been on your car a long time, install the different intake and dyno that a few months later, trying to make the weather conditions as similar as possible on the two days. __________________ Last edited by Jesse IL : 05-31-2002 at 03:51 PM.

05-31-2002, 03:50 PM	#25
WAR All Spyder Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Calgary Posts: 1,145 iTrader: (0)	JesseIL: can you answer my AEM install question above? Thanks, __________________ WAR '00 MR2 Spyder (extremely moded) '00 GT-S Carbon Blue, Gone but not forgotten

05-31-2002, 04:08 PM	#27
Raymund Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: LA CA Posts: 839 iTrader: (0)	good job, thx __________________ Celica GTS; sold.. remaining mods for sale @.. http://newcelica.org/forums/showthre...hreadid=109195 S2000 Civic DX

05-31-2002, 04:13 PM	#28
tripnotic I come in peace! Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana (LSU ALUMNI) Posts: 860 iTrader: (0)	The most surprising about the INjen Cai, that someone on this site with only a Injen CAI can hit 14.3-14.4. I forgot who it was that was on this site but he has a timeslip and video for it.

08-28-2002, 01:15 PM	#30
inline4 I drive a Civic Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 935 iTrader: (0)	because if all our cars were freaks there wouldn't be any freaks to call freaks... and we would all be original. But than there would still be freaks that hit 13's!.... or something. __________________ Directions in Haynes Manual: "Carefully..." Translation: You are about to suffer deep abrasions.

08-29-2002, 02:12 AM	#31
gtsmonkee eh? =X Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 14 iTrader: (0)	so hmm track wise? injen is better or aem with the trd ext. exhaust... dang im still confused oh yeah...Jesse. do you have the time slip for your aem/trd combo? Last edited by gtsmonkee : 08-29-2002 at 09:14 AM.

08-29-2002, 10:36 AM	#32
Jesse IL GT2871R Inside Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 17,993 iTrader: (11)	Damn, reviving the old school threads. No, I have never taken my car to the track with the AEM/TRD combo. __________________

08-29-2002, 11:09 AM	#33
DominicanLou Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 287 iTrader: (0)	I think it was micronrice who hit those low-mid 14s. __________________ 2002 Super White GT-S 6 Speed Uhm.. Bone Stock, uhh yea... that's it!

08-29-2002, 02:58 PM	#34
Jesse IL GT2871R Inside Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 17,993 iTrader: (11)	There have been people with AEM intakes who have hit 14.4 or maybe even 14.3. To get that low, all they were doing was unbolting the exhaust and trying to remove weight from the car. Next time I am at the strip I will be running with the TRD exhaust removed. __________________

08-29-2002, 05:56 PM	#35
inline4 I drive a Civic Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 935 iTrader: (0)	This thread deserves to be brought back up.... it's like... kool and informative. __________________ Directions in Haynes Manual: "Carefully..." Translation: You are about to suffer deep abrasions.

08-29-2002, 07:13 PM	#36
outhouse Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 210 iTrader: (0)	1rst dont kid yourself about exhuast There is a very noticable difference with the TRD I can feel allot of power and it is definatly worth the money hand's down the #2 mod that should be done. The first is a CAI far the best bang for the buck. Both AEM and Injen are good products and a dyno is hard to test and get decent results as noted above. As far as the @ss gauge ive heard from people [many] who have had both and 99% say they cannot tell the difference, as well I have not heard one post saying I lost track time because I went too AEM from Injen. I give AEM the slight advantage for one reason CARB legal to smog saweeeet

08-30-2002, 09:43 AM	#37
byebyebaby Registered User Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Morristown, NJ Posts: 533 iTrader: (0)	Very interesting that for the GT things are reversed....Injen made better HP over all, with AEM only beat injen at the peak value by a hair... __________________ Cheers, Andy Nguyen ex-VVT-i nut 2005 Dodge caravan SXT with stowaway baby

08-31-2002, 08:51 PM	#38
larryd Uhm... I run this place Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Bear, DE Posts: 21,884 iTrader: (23)	the only thing that can really be said here guys is every car. every setup, is going to yeild slightly different results.. you can see clearly on mine that Injen definitely made more power all throughout the curve.. I explained it all when I got that intake along the lines of this.. AEM definitely has a better bottom end, I felt the torque difference with the AEM though the dyno didnt really show it, but the Injen just pulled up top like there was no tomorrow.. When I first put on the Injen I remember saying to myself I cant wait to go to the dyno and get this overwith so I can put my AEM back on and be done with it.. WELL DAMN.. I got to the dyno and holy hell.. the #s spoke for themselves and the car pullign isnanely up top did me in.. I coulda caredless about torque as all I wanted was top end power from 6-8300. Also another thing, I had the AEM on the car for a while. I dynoed it, and then the very next day I took the Injen to the dyno so if anything the ECU didnt adjust to the Injen and it coulda very well made even more power.. Both dynos were SAE corrected to be the same conditions on the same gas etc etc etc.. nothing else changed other then swapping intakes.. one last thing.. you guys are putting way to much emphasis on the dynos.. both intakes kick butt.. Im an Injen sales man and I wont tell you not to get AEM cuz its a good intake.. A race will not be determined by one person havingt the AEM and one person have the INJEN.. its not that much of a difference.. good luck in your decisions and remember if you do choose Injen I do sell them here on the site for a great price....

08-31-2002, 10:31 PM	#39
2002GT_Celica ... Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 4,198 iTrader: (0)	Well, that does it, I am sold on the AEM CAI. I need as much power down low as possible since I have an auto. __________________ 1995 del Sol w/ H22 Too many mods to list here

08-31-2002, 11:19 PM	#40
inline4 I drive a Civic Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 935 iTrader: (0)	Yeah but AEM doesn't make intake's for autos... Maybe you can get it to fit somehow? __________________ Directions in Haynes Manual: "Carefully..." Translation: You are about to suffer deep abrasions.