New Intake Manifold for GTS / 2ZZ - huge power gains

[Boosted2.0]

Cliff Notes: We built a new intake manifold and its incredible. It made 22 HP versus stock on a fully tuned power FC. The first production run of 20 is already sold out but we have started a second group buy for $1250 / manifold


Read on for more info:

Here are the results of the first round of dyno testing. To make a long story short we made 23 HP peak and over 35 at the old lift transition. There is no power dip on with the manifold so its kind of hard to tell but the new lifttransition is at 4600 RPM. This is the same car, same day same dyno - we never even unstrapped it off the dyno since the intake is very easy to swap from above. JesseIL was in town for work and came by and he was present the whole time as an independent observer and he also helped out with the Power FC tuning (thanks Jesse!)

The car used was Littlerockets GTS. Its a stock junkyard motor he put in when he hydrolocked the other motor a few months ago. It has about 75K on it and it uses a bit of oil. (went through between 1/2 and 3/4 quarts on the dyno). It had a stock header that I ported, a straight pipe with no cat and a Magnaflow muffler. The engine itself is bone stock and actually seems pretty weak so the overall numbers for before and after would probably have been considerably higher on a healthy one, let alone one with head work and cams and a racing header. The before numbers are a stock intake and TB. The after numbers are out prototype intake and Q45 throttle body. We expect to be able to further improve the numbers with the production intake by probably 4 or 5 HP. (The prototype has the runners attached to the plenum with soft rubber couplers which we couldn't keep from sagging that resulted in misalignment - we had to do this to allow us to change teh runner length for testing. This is the STREET intake manifold - it clears the Celica hood with no problem. One component will be relocated and the appropriate bracket will be included in the kit.

We were unable to determine the full capabilities of the new intake manifold because, while we did have 440cc injectors on the car, we had a bad fuel filter and had to stop at about 190 HP so we never bothered to shorten the runner length to see what power we could make with a higher torque peak.

We haven't finishe dtestign yet but we did get one more shot that I don't have teh run files for, but we hit 194 and moved the torque peak slightly.

Without further ado here is the dyno - I will post more information about the days activities further down in the post.

Our manifold Versus stock with a Power FC - same tune, same dyno, same day:


Our Manifold Versus stock with a Power FC - both fully tuned for that setup, same dyno same day




Oh - we will NOT post pictures of the manifold until they are being sold, but here is a teaser pic of one of the sexy custom CNC head flanges we are having made:



And the CNC IAC mount and TB cable mount:




Also as promised I took some video clips for sound purposes and here they are:

Stock intake manifold with Injen CAI:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNa2uYe9CjM


DD Performance Research Prototype Manifold making a dyno pull:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hd85z8DPhas


DD Performance Research intake manifold blipping throttle - notice how damn fast this thing responds and revs - it sounds like a friggin bike:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZwGgBBzr2Y



Presenting the very first full production DD Performance Research Intake Manifold - I hope you all like it..










Some pictures to show throttle body mounting and the IAC / Throttle Cable mount setup. Note that the throttle linkage and IAC are mounted under the plenum which gives a nice clean appearance to the installation.






So there you have it. I'm pretty sure I can safely say that if you buy EVERY other bolt on part you can get and run them ALL with the stock ECU you won't even make a combined 30 HP gain. Oh - and it sounds cool as hell.



The Group buy is full and closed. The first production run of 20 units is sold out. We will take orders and announce pricing for the second production run once we figure out exactly how much the first run actually cost us to build when all is said and done. Expect a number between $1000 and $1300

We will most likely be accepting a "layaway" style of ordering starting with the second production run.

These prices do NOT include the Q45 Throttle body which can be had for anywhere from $50 - $150 used on Ebay.

We will offer an adapter to allow the stock DBW TB to be used instead of the Q45 TB. We will also offer an adapter for a larger DBW throttle body.


The intake will be heavy gauge aluminum and feature a CNC head flange, CNC intake bells, Computerized mandrel bent runners, CNC plenum end etc.


Group Buy list:

1 - Leppardized
2 - Zaneman
3 - grimreaper253
4 - EMSRacerCeli03
5 - Roukai
6 - Many (tentative)
7 - bt216
8 - Black2000gts
9 - aznboi716
10 - celica_2nr


We also have figured out the final pricing now that we have all the parts assembled - mixed bag on that news. Turns out we actually lost money on the frst group buy of 10 when you figure all the production costs. BUT we couldn't have managed to come up with all the money for the raw materials without their deposits so I guess they get REALLY REALLY cheap manifolds.

The second group of 10 from the first round of orders we will sell for $1200 which was the maximum anticipated price we had told them


The full retail price from here on forward is going to be $1400. We realize this is a goodly sum of money, so we have decided to run one more group buy after all. The price will be $1250. The number of orders we will need to take to hit this price is going to be 20 peices. We will take $700 deposits on the second group buy. You name will be added once funds have been received.

The completion time for the second batch should be way lower, as everything is CNC and now that all the drawings are done and welding jibs are built, the lead time to get parts and get manifolds built should be significantly lower. I would guestimate it at about a month and a half from close of second group buy to shipment of manifolds.


Group Buy 2:

1 - Youngxlos
2 - Herb VGT
3 - Celica GT Layne
4 -
5 -
6 -
7 -
8 -
9 -
10 -
11 -
12 -
13 -
14 -
15 -
16 -
17 -
18 -
19 -
20 -




If you definitely want in on the second production run please send your $700 paypal deposit to Boostedalltrac@yahoo.com and include ALL of the following information:

Name:
NC screen name:
Shipping Address:
Phone Number:
Year and model of vehicle:
Indicate that this is a deposit for the intake manifold

[Boosted2.0]

Oh - DD performance stands for Dave and David (thats me and littlerocket)

[EMSRacerCeli03]

great job boosted thats huge gain on almost stock motor. do we get to see pics of the manifold?

[Soo__Fuego]

wow

[theguy216]

HOLY ****!! If the street intake did that well on a prototype run I cannot believe what the race intake will do. Looks like I need to start saving now.

[euromotorsports]

quick question with stock tb,ecu, will you still be able to use stock injectors and fuel pump? or will you need to upgrade both to larger injectors and/or fuelpump? Also for 850 does it include both the Q45 TB an the Stock TB adaptor??

[EMSRacerCeli03]

^^^^yeah i would like to know that too to see if we need to upgrade our fuel system to work with it, or at least tune with it. How well do you think it will work on the stock ECU?

[Roukai]

Congrats Boosted and Littlerocket! glad to see that all the hard work paid off in spades!

[Boosted2.0]

We spent about an hour and a half trying to get the best possible numebrs on the stock setup before we switched to the new intake. Here are the before and after results for that tuning:





And here are more zoomed in Graphs that show the difference in torque and HP between the tuned stock intake and our tuned prototype intake:








We spent over 2 1/2 hours tuning the new intake with (obviously) good results. There is definitely still room for improment though and we will make another trip to the dyno as soon as possible with a new fuel pump and see what kind of damage we can do if we move the torque peak from 6800 up to 8000. We anticipate over 200 HP.

Based on the HP to CFM gains ratio for the intake we did some ricer math, and with stage 3 piper cams, this intake and TB and a P&P head and a race exhaust like the PPE we anticipate that over 240 WHP should be possible. With increases in comrpession ratio and the introduction of race gas we estimate that 270 WHP may be possible.

[ZaneMan]

Looks promising, possibly willing to indepandant dyno. PM me if you need people.

[yakboyslim]

Very impressive. More than I really thought it would get since I always thought the stock wasn't a bad design

I want to win the lottery or something so I can get one. Can't wait to see the "race" mani results.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by euromotorsports

quick question with stock tb,ecu, will you still be able to use stock injectors and fuel pump? or will you need to upgrade both to larger injectors and/or fuelpump? Also for 850 does it include both the Q45 TB an the Stock TB adaptor??

That does not include the throttle body (we got ours used on EBAY for $90). We will look into obtaining some throttle bodies to save you the trouble of having to hunt one down if you don't want to bother.

With this TB there is no question that you will need the bigger injectors and fuel pump - the stockers are not up to making this kind of power. With the stock TB it is POSSIBLE that you will be OK, but I wouldn't put any money on it.

Originally Posted by EMSRacerCeli03

^^^^yeah i would like to know that too to see if we need to upgrade our fuel system to work with it, or at least tune with it. How well do you think it will work on the stock ECU?

Stock ECU should be fine with the stock TB, but fueling may be an issue at high RPM in 3rd gear and higher and you won't be able to take advantage of the 4600 RPM cam changeover the new manifold makes possible.

Originally Posted by EMSRacerCeli03

great job boosted thats huge gain on almost stock motor. do we get to see pics of the manifold?

Thanks and no!

I'll post pictures whenever the production manifold is done and on sale. It does look badass though.

[yakboyslim]

Based on the HP to CFM gains ratio for the intake we did some ricer math, and with stage 3 piper cams, this intake and TB and a P&P head and a race exhaust like the PPE we anticipate that over 240 WHP should be possible. With increases in comrpession ratio and the introduction of race gas we estimate that 270 WHP may be possible.

Wait, 270 whp?!

I've always said that with the right parts and deep enough pockets Celicas could hit numbers like that. Someone needs to make it happen, make the plunge and build a high comp full race n/a motor. None of this stretching for 200 whp while running stock comp and a full exhaust. We need a universally impressive n/a 2zz out there somewhere, not just impressive compared to other 2zz's.

[theguy216]

HOLY ****!! If your ricer math is accurate this is going to kick the ass of any B series motor running a N/A setup. Celicasaur needs to jump on this and dyno it on his setup.

[Pulsar1]

That is rediculous. Worth every penny imo. I don't think you'll find a better power adder for the 2zz outside of F/I. Nice job guys. Worth the wait.

How big are the q45 TBs? I know the MAF are like 90mm iirc.

[EMSRacerCeli03]

dang 270whp will be many with this thing lol and alot of other guys lol thats so unreal lol awesome job

[theguy216]

Honda Fanboy's lookout for the 2zz. Good god of all the weak points on the 2zz i didn't expect it to be the intake manifold. it's seemed like a fairly solid design. short runner length without many curves. A built head with this manifold is going to be ridiculous in lift.

[Soo__Fuego]

boosted u said u werent able to test the other different length runners ........... does that mean there will be different length street manifolds or was the other the "race" version?

[fraugts]

Congratz...
Amazing numbers...

[EMSRacerCeli03]

what kind of fuel upgrade do you recommend boosted? like fuel pump and cc on the injectors? dude im so EXCITED MAN IM SAVING UP RIGHT NOW!!!!

[theguy216]

I would assume they were testing to see what the best length was for the street version or testing the race version as well. can't imagine they would offer anything but the highest output runner length for the street intake.

[Proximity]

Originally Posted by theguy216

Celicasaur needs to jump on this and dyno it on his setup.

He should get one for free.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by ZaneMan

Looks promising, possibly willing to indepandant dyno. PM me if you need people.

Considering that JesseIL was there the whole time, the dyno we used belongs to Carboy and was set up by carboy, and we never took the car off the dyno, you can pretty much trust that these results are unbiased and accurate. As a side note, the "after" numebrs were from pull 76 This is a joint venture with LR so any independent dyno discount would have to be in the form of a refund after the dynos and LR would have to approve. I suspect we will mainly be interested in someone like Many who has cams and headwork, etc or a local guy. Frankly the gains were high enough even without tuning that we probably won't really need much in the way of independant confirmation.

Originally Posted by yakboyslim

Very impressive. More than I really thought it would get since I always thought the stock wasn't a bad design

I want to win the lottery or something so I can get one. Can't wait to see the "race" mani results.

We were pretty floored too. I mean, I knew that our manifold kicked the stock ones butt on the flowbench, but I was expecting like 10, maybe 15 HP. 23 peak with a LOWER torque peak RPM than stock was completely unexpected, but I guess this is what happens when you do your homework and have a flowbench to prove out your design rather than just throwing some crap together and bolting it to a car and hoping.

I'm really not sure the race manifold will do much better as the gains we are looking for there are based more on a fundamental design change than a flow increase, but I am sure at this point that it is going to cost at least $400 - $500 more than the street manifold due to a couple of factors.

[theguy216]

Originally Posted by EMSRacerCeli03

what kind of fuel upgrade do you recommend boosted? like fuel pump and cc on the injectors? dude im so EXCITED MAN IM SAVING UP RIGHT NOW!!!!

hahah i know what you mean. looks like i'm gonna need a PFC, an upgraded TB and the new manifold. If I work my ass off during summer maybe i'll be able to afford it by the time school starts up.

[Soo__Fuego]

Originally Posted by theguy216

I would assume they were testing to see what the best length was for the street version or testing the race version as well. can't imagine they would offer anything but the highest output runner length for the street intake.

well the best performing version for a stock motor (like the one tested) might not be the best performing for a fully built head motor, or a full race motor, offering different lengths might be possible, Boosted?

[theguy216]

Originally Posted by Boosted2.0

Considering that JesseIL was there the whole time, the dyno we used belongs to Carboy and was set up by carboy, and we never took the car off the dyno, you can pretty much trust that these results are unbiased and accurate. As a side note, the "after" numebrs were from pull 76 This is a joint venture with LR so any independent dyno discount would have to be in the form of a refund after the dynos and LR would have to approve. I suspect we will mainly be interested in someone like Many who has cams and headwork, etc or a local guy. Frankly the gains were high enough even without tuning that we probably won't really need much in the way of independant confirmation.

If there is anyone on the forum who doesn't need independent confirmation of a design it is you Boosted. no one has put the time or money into developing the 2zz that you and the intake team has. it's hella nice to have someone who is interested in furthering the 2zz first and a profit second developing for us. hell whatever both designs of the manifolds cost it;s about the best you can get on a HP to dollar ratio.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by yakboyslim

Wait, 270 whp?!

I've always said that with the right parts and deep enough pockets Celicas could hit numbers like that. Someone needs to make it happen, make the plunge and build a high comp full race n/a motor. None of this stretching for 200 whp while running stock comp and a full exhaust. We need a universally impressive n/a 2zz out there somewhere, not just impressive compared to other 2zz's.

LR has a Lotus he is working on right now with 13.5:1 CR and a fully built motor and head that will be at LEAST at 240/250 to the tire and may hit that 270 mark.

Originally Posted by theguy216

HOLY ****!! If your ricer math is accurate this is going to kick the ass of any B series motor running a N/A setup. Celicasaur needs to jump on this and dyno it on his setup.

Basically we took the CFM difference between a stock head with our intake and a stock head with stock intake and assigned a CFM to HP gain ratio based on that info. Its fuzzy math to be sure, but in a couple months people with totally stock internals will be over 200 with just PPE race header and this thing, PFC and fuel system.

Originally Posted by Pulsar1

That is rediculous. Worth every penny imo. I don't think you'll find a better power adder for the 2zz outside of F/I. Nice job guys. Worth the wait.

How big are the q45 TBs? I know the MAF are like 90mm iirc.

The ID at the throttle plate is 84mm

Originally Posted by theguy216

Honda Fanboy's lookout for the 2zz. Good god of all the weak points on the 2zz i didn't expect it to be the intake manifold. it's seemed like a fairly solid design. short runner length without many curves. A built head with this manifold is going to be ridiculous in lift.

I know - everyone thought the same, myself included. It makes sense in retrospect though - as nice as the head is it should have performed closer to the Honda K series motors.

Originally Posted by Soo__Fuego

boosted u said u werent able to test the other different length runners ........... does that mean there will be different length street manifolds or was the other the "race" version?

Not sure on that, we migth eventually do that for an additional fee. We will definitely find an optimum runner length for stock head and cams, but considering how the manifold is designed it is possible we may be able to offer differing lengths within reason. There are some packaging concerns that limit our flexibility there however. Frankly I'm thrilled with it as it is. Remember when we started this I wasn;t even sure if I could make it fit under the hood and make any kind of reasonable gains - now look where we are.

Originally Posted by fraugts

Congratz...
Amazing numbers...

Thanks!

Originally Posted by EMSRacerCeli03

what kind of fuel upgrade do you recommend boosted? like fuel pump and cc on the injectors? dude im so EXCITED MAN IM SAVING UP RIGHT NOW!!!!

440cc injectors and 190 LPH pump

Originally Posted by theguy216

I would assume they were testing to see what the best length was for the street version or testing the race version as well. can't imagine they would offer anything but the highest output runner length for the street intake.

Correct - it will come with the best possible runner length that lets us keep it under the hood.

[theguy216]

Originally Posted by Soo__Fuego

well the best performing version for a stock motor (like the one tested) might not be the best performing for a fully built head motor, or a full race motor, offering different lengths might be possible, Boosted?

Good point. That would be a PITA though to offer multiple runner length. I'd go with whatever offered the best numbers for a built motor and be done with it. either way we are looking at a substantial gain on a stock motor and an even better gain on a race motor.

[Roukai]

Originally Posted by theguy216

hahah i know what you mean. looks like i'm gonna need a PFC, an upgraded TB and the new manifold. If I work my ass off during summer maybe i'll be able to afford it by the time school starts up.

PFC? yeah, im a n00b. Power Factor Correction?.. yeah.. that's not what it means, but dealing with ac electrical problem solving most of the week (trying to test into a higher paygrade for work) has me brain dead atm.

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by theguy216

Good point. That would be a PITA though to offer multiple runner length. I'd go with whatever offered the best numbers for a built motor and be done with it. either way we are looking at a substantial gain on a stock motor and an even better gain on a race motor.

Think about this for a minute.

Built motors are few and far between and very expensive.

THIS on the other hand is something pretty much anyone can do in 2 hours in their driveway. No built motor required. Tons of people buy headers, even the PPE headers, but never go into the motor.

Plus, as I said, packaging is an issue. There are some very finite limits to how much we can change this and still clear all the underhood components.

[theguy216]

Alright I'm gonna go celebrate now (who am i kidding i started hours ago). I'll check back later. congrats Boosted. you sir are my new hero!

[Soo__Fuego]

the tundra dbw tb about the same size as the q45?

[Boosted2.0]

PFC = Apexi Power FC - its a tuneable ECU that replaces the stock ECU

[bloodytiger]

Any Pics yet?

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by theguy216

Alright I'm gonna go celebrate now (who am i kidding i started hours ago). I'll check back later. congrats Boosted. you sir are my new hero!

So did we - we went straight from the dyno to Hooters for a few beers

Originally Posted by Soo__Fuego

the tundra dbw tb about the same size as the q45?

the one for the 5.7 is - I'll have to measure it to get an exact number on it.

[theguy216]

Originally Posted by Boosted2.0

Think about this for a minute.

Built motors are few and far between and very expensive.

THIS on the other hand is something pretty much anyone can do in 2 hours in their driveway. No built motor required. Tons of people buy headers, even the PPE headers, but never go into the motor.

Plus, as I said, packaging is an issue. There are some very finite limits to how much we can change this and still clear all the underhood components.

True. I'll likely never be able to afford a PFC plus TB and this manifold anyways but I have enough honda friends who rag on the 2zz enough that i'd be willing to give up this manifold in order to see a built celica destroy a built k series motor

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by bloodytiger

Any Pics yet?

Nope, and there won't be any until the final product is complete and being delivered.

[theguy216]

Originally Posted by bloodytiger

Any Pics yet?

hahah you sir do not deserve a picture. trying to destroy my hope by saying they blew up the motor. shame on you.

[Soo__Fuego]

Originally Posted by Boosted2.0

Basically we took the CFM difference between a stock head with our intake and a stock head with stock intake and assigned a CFM to HP gain ratio based on that info. Its fuzzy math to be sure, but in a couple months people with totally stock internals will be over 200 with just PPE race header and this thing, PFC and fuel system.


.

most b-series wont touch 200 on pure bolts on alone or without cams, so yeah, no k-series numbers but like u said closer to k than b

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by theguy216

True. I'll likely never be able to afford a PFC plus TB and this manifold anyways but I have enough honda friends who rag on the 2zz enough that i'd be willing to give up this manifold in order to see a built celica destroy a built k series motor

We're planning on trying the 190 lph pump, the 440cc injectors and a 3" CAI on a stock ECU to see what happens. The 440s are 27% bigger than stock and the 3" pipe is 27% bigger than the Injen, so the fueling may actually wind up faily close to correct.

[Soo__Fuego]

one more question boosted before i shut up, i dont have the money now, but i have a spare kidney in good shape care to trade for the street version + 03 pfc harness

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by Soo__Fuego

one more question boosted before i shut up, i dont have the money now, but i have a spare kidney in good shape care to trade for the street version + 03 pfc harness

Tempting, but I'm not sure how I could make more power with a kidney - let me think on it

[bloodytiger]

Originally Posted by theguy216

hahah you sir do not deserve a picture. trying to destroy my hope by saying they blew up the motor. shame on you.

[theguy216]

Originally Posted by Soo__Fuego

one more question boosted before i shut up, i dont have the money now, but i have a spare kidney in good shape care to trade for the street version + 03 pfc harness

hahah i will sell my kidney plus half of my liver (it's in very good condition, well maybe not after tonight) and maybe even a lung for a manifold and TB.

[jlitman]

Wow -- incredible! Amazing job! First thing I thought was with this IM, the PPE header, and a good PFC tune, 200+ N/A with bolt on's can be gotten on the stock motor!

I do have two quick questions out of curiosity:

(1) So this will fit under the stock hood (I really want to see what it looks like!!!)?

(2) Not that I'm doubting the validity of the dynos in the slightest, or questioning the proportionate gain over the stock IM, but could you post SAE corrected versions for comparison and some info on ambient temps?

[Boosted2.0]

Originally Posted by jlitman

Wow -- incredible! Amazing job! First thing I thought was with this IM, the PPE header, and a good PFC tune, 200+ N/A with bolt on's can be gotten on the stock motor!

I do have two quick questions out of curiosity:

(1) So this will fit under the stock hood (I really want to see what it looks like!!!)?

(2) Not that I'm doubting the validity of the dynos in the slightest, or questioning the proportionate gain over the stock IM, but could you post SAE corrected versions for comparison and some info on ambient temps?

1 - Yup - clears the hood with room to spare.

2 - Sure. The dyno has a weather station so all the data was entered automatically, including temp and humidity. It also had a functioning RPM pickup so this is based on an actual RPM sense, not a purely wheelspeed calculation.

I'll get the graphs saved as JPGs and load them in a few minutes.

[EMSRacerCeli03]

hey boosted how much would the bigger TB be on top of the IM? WHat are your expectations with ppl with turbos and rotex systems? Hope alot bigger gains.

[EMSRacerCeli03]

so did you guys changed the lift transition to 4.5k rpms? how did the car feel haveing lift that low?

[Soo__Fuego]

Originally Posted by EMSRacerCeli03

hey boosted how much would the bigger TB be on top of the IM?

the q45 tb is 84mm, how much more u need?

[youngxlos]

when is the dead line???