Heavier but stickier and also better final drive...

when i was auto-x ing i used the olod Falken Azenis, but they are not made anymore and i dont know how good the new style is. now i put BFG KDW2 on all my cars. good sticky tire,.

I'd go with the Falken all day long, 7 days of the week

You're nuts to even consider autocrossing on Proxes T1s instead of Azenis.

Get the Azenis.

Thank you for the rapid and clear responses

Will the extra weight severely hamper straight line acceleration, or will this be offset by the better grip and improved final drive?

Does anyone else have another suggestion for a very good tire, lighter than the Falkens but just as sticky (assume price is no object) for street and track?

Check out the Nitto NT-01's.

ironracer4130 said:

Check out the Nitto NT-01's.

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Those are R compound tires and there are way better R-comps than those for autocross. The NT-01 is a descendant of the Toyo RA-1 (same company) with a better non-shaved tread pattern. It's a good track/extreme street tire but I would buy some v710s for autocross.

jlitman said:

Thank you for the rapid and clear responses

Will the extra weight severely hamper straight line acceleration, or will this be offset by the better grip and improved final drive?

Does anyone else have another suggestion for a very good tire, lighter than the Falkens but just as sticky (assume price is no object) for street and track?

Click to expand...

The improved final drive will help a small bit but the sidewall and compound of the Azenis is much better suited to autocross. I wouldn't consider buying anything but Falken Azenis but since you said price was no object look into the Advan Neovas, there's a lot of buzz about it being "the tire to have" this year in STU.

Very cool, thanks! I'll check it out :thumbup:

i don't think any tires out there will beat the azenis at the same price range.. the neovas i think are about twice as expensive..

but if you're running your car in autox it'd be in SM... maybe pick up a set of R compounds on a set of spare wheels to make the car more competitive in that class

If you have to get it in 15" then I suggest the Falken. The smallest Neova is 17".

My only concern was weight. The Toyos are soooo freaking light. Anyone know if there's a tire database floating around? Tirerack site is good, but their listing of tires is finite.

TaeMachine said:

If you have to get it in 15" then I suggest the Falken. The smallest Neova is 17".

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smallest neova from yokohama usa is 17. They also come in 15"s.

jlitman said:

My only concern was weight. The Toyos are soooo freaking light. Anyone know if there's a tire database floating around? Tirerack site is good, but their listing of tires is finite.

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the sidewall construction on the falkens are so much more beefy, the whole tire is a lot more suitable for autox. I didn't like the T1S compound in the dry, it's okay for winter series in the wet; but in an autox course, cornering capability of the car is more important..

The T1S are often compared to the FK451; their wet times are simliar, but the FK comes out on top in dry handling/braking due to better sidewalls.. and that's with the FK451 in unshaved form. The RT will be -that- much better with better sidewalls yet and more rubber on the ground

i just saw the comparison of the sizes you're considering running, i've run 205/50 15" azenis before, and it was good and fun before boost.. i really wouldn't recommend running the 195 T1S with your set up... it may give you too much tire spin out of exits.

What do you guys think of this tire -- never saw it before -- is it fairly new?

Dunlop Direzza GRP
P205/50R15, 16.8 lbs and P225/50R15, 17.0 lbs

Looks pretty grippy with nice big tread blocks... but... I can't seem to find a UTQG rating, so I'm a bit worried it's in the doouble digits and therefore relatively unsuitable for a DD (remember, I want tires for performance autox AND DDing).

More info at http://www.dunloptires.com/catalog/direzzaGRP.html

In short, the size, weight, and grip potential looks right. Just a bit worried about the durability (don't really want to drop below 200 UTQG).

Any thoughts? :eatpop:

that's a DOT drag radial... it looks to be more streetable than like the BFG drag radial; sidewalls will be soft and compound will be soft also (would make sense for why they're lighter).. not really what you're looking for for daily.

for daily doubling as autox tires, the falken azenis would be the best choice.. but if you want something that has more grooves for treading water, there's the Kumho MX. They cost about the same and the kumho would last slightly longer than the azenis. About that same price range, slightly more expensive, there is the hankook ventus RS2. I've never tried this tire before, but apparently just as sticky as the azenis in the dry and heard good track reviews. But, if you want to stick with Toyo, there is always the T1R for a few bucks more.

Monster Hui said:

that's a DOT drag radial... it looks to be more streetable than like the BFG drag radial; sidewalls will be soft and compound will be soft also (would make sense for why they're lighter).. not really what you're looking for for daily.

for daily doubling as autox tires, the falken azenis would be the best choice.. but if you want something that has more grooves for treading water, there's the Kumho MX. They cost about the same and the kumho would last slightly longer than the azenis. About that same price range, slightly more expensive, there is the hankook ventus RS2. I've never tried this tire before, but apparently just as sticky as the azenis in the dry and heard good track reviews. But, if you want to stick with Toyo, there is always the T1R for a few bucks more.

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Hmmm... so you think it probably has a UTQG <100 Rats -- if it's even a little over 100 I may just try it, even tho' my Toyos, which have a rating of 280, are close to disintergrating at EXACTLY the 1 year mark...

I just emailed Dunlop to find out more about the Direzzas. Looks like this tire was just released, so it may not even have a rating yet.

The T1R is the replacement for the T1-S, so I'm guessing about as sticky. I'm definitely leaning more towards the new Azenis... I've had the Ecsta MX's and they were really good, but they're only about 1 lb lighter for the same size, so the Azenis are still looking more desirable.

Argh... looks like I need to do a bit more research... I'll check out the Hankook Ventus R2's -- thanks for the suggestion! :thumbup:

the T1R are more grippy than the T1S.. but i'm not sure if they changed the compound. Even if the treadwear for those direzzas are ~100, their sidewalls will be too soft for autocross. If you're considering running R compounds that are okay for daily, there is the toyo RA1 that has treadwear of 100. Or something cheaper, would be the A032R in the hard compound (still a treadwear of 50 i think). Or if you're more baller, the A048 in the medium hard compound (treadwear of 60). But let me tell you, i do not recommend anyone to run R compounds for daily; unless you got them cheap. I ran a set of slightly used set of A048 in medium compound, even with constant rotation they only lasted me 2 months. If the T1S lasted you only a year, i wouldn't think the R's would last more than 1 month.


think the hankook may be worth a try really.

How much time do you get between runs?

The Hankook and Falken will need to be water-sprayed between runs on most days (they don't deal with heat well).

The Hankook and Kumho really ought to be shaved for optimal performance (the Flakn benefits too, but not as much).

The Kuhmo is the only one of the 3 that will not require water spraying, in fact it tends to get better with heat.

I'm not sure about the Hankook, but the Kuhmo has a much softer sidewall than the Falken and will work best if you have a little more negative camber. The Kuhmo is a fast tire, but it will take more setup effort to get 100% out of it than the Falken will.

I tried the kumho in the 205/15" on the light weight 15" rims that Profile is trying to sell. They worked as well if not better than the old 215 Azenis in a wider 225 16 size. They had to be shaved, and lasted as long as the unshaved Azenis, but then I just used them for Autocross. Once you get down to a specific size of tire, you might have to try several tires to find one you like. They all have different characteristics and operating ranges. Void in the tire, i.e. wher eit is cut out, also impacts how the tire performs. Autxr has a good feel for how these three tires perfrom.

autxr said:

How much time do you get between runs?

The Hankook and Falken will need to be water-sprayed between runs on most days (they don't deal with heat well).

The Hankook and Kumho really ought to be shaved for optimal performance (the Flakn benefits too, but not as much).

The Kuhmo is the only one of the 3 that will not require water spraying, in fact it tends to get better with heat.

I'm not sure about the Hankook, but the Kuhmo has a much softer sidewall than the Falken and will work best if you have a little more negative camber. The Kuhmo is a fast tire, but it will take more setup effort to get 100% out of it than the Falken will.

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I'm a fairly infrequent autoxer planning on doing it more often soon, so this will still see way more time on the street than the track. I guess I really want an awesome street tire that can double as an autox tire.

Thank you for the detailed advice!