NewCelica.org Forum banner

Status
Not open for further replies.
41 - 60 of 67 Posts

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
I sent Pave High a "final" PM yesterday. Even if PayPal forces him to make a refund, he'll still get the shady seller status, unless he turns around and does the right thing.

Unfortunately, it seems he's going the way of Japukspares and others regular members who just decided to throw away their reputation before running away from the forum like cowards.

Bodes well for his precious Facebook Celica community, right?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
354 Posts
It's unfortunate when this happens, especially when it's from a member with a good reputation. It doesn't matter whether the transaction with the buyer was extremely horrid, just refund their money and move on with life. Avoid that buyer(becausr yes, buyers can also be blacklisted) and keep your reputation.

I hope this works out.
 

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
I still havent got it back.
Havent heard from him and still waiting on PayPal.
:marky: If he doesn't answer the PayPal dispute, they will simply take the money back, so I find it incredibly stupid of him to ignore this simple and unavoidable process.
 

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
I just got a message from Pave High saying that the refund is complete. Johny123456, please confirm.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
946 Posts
Just to add my $.02, shipping a bumper/body kit is a lot harder than most people think. I've shipped out quite a few and a single bumper or single pair of side skirts is fairly easy to ship within the US using greyhound. However, shipping overseas is an entirely different beast. Also, making a box to fit a bumper and side skirts is ridiculous.

I shipped out a full VS kit and between bubble wrap, adhesive, cardboard, tape etc. I spent well over $100. I also had a box that measured 84" x 40" x 40" constructed out of 30 smaller boxes. It took me roughly 10-12 hours to make over the course of 2 weeks. Then after all that, you have to find a way to transport it to whoever is shipping it (not many people have access to a vehicle that will carry this).

It's a very time consuming process and can be very overwhelming if you've never done it before. It seems that he didn't quite understand all the time and money needed to ship them to you and just wanted to refund you the money. Then you pushed a little and he decided to give in (which he shouldn't have b/c it just pushed him further into the hole) and we ended up here.

Another problem that you run into with this kind of transaction is that when it happens, people usually transfer the money to their bank account and it ends up getting spent assuming you'll ship the parts out. Then, a few weeks down the road you find out it's going to be difficult but you've already spent the money so you try to make it work whichever way you can. Then a few months down the road the buyer wants a refund but it's been 4 months since you received payment and not many people have $1000 (assuming that was close to the price including shipping) just laying around to give back to you.
 

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
Just checked my account and it still nothing

Can he sent me a picture of the transacties?
Ask him, or PayPal.

Just to add my $.02, shipping a bumper/body kit is a lot harder than most people think. I've shipped out quite a few and a single bumper or single pair of side skirts is fairly easy to ship within the US using greyhound. However, shipping overseas is an entirely different beast. Also, making a box to fit a bumper and side skirts is ridiculous.

I shipped out a full VS kit and between bubble wrap, adhesive, cardboard, tape etc. I spent well over $100. I also had a box that measured 84" x 40" x 40" constructed out of 30 smaller boxes. It took me roughly 10-12 hours to make over the course of 2 weeks. Then after all that, you have to find a way to transport it to whoever is shipping it (not many people have access to a vehicle that will carry this).

It's a very time consuming process and can be very overwhelming if you've never done it before. It seems that he didn't quite understand all the time and money needed to ship them to you and just wanted to refund you the money. Then you pushed a little and he decided to give in (which he shouldn't have b/c it just pushed him further into the hole) and we ended up here.

Another problem that you run into with this kind of transaction is that when it happens, people usually transfer the money to their bank account and it ends up getting spent assuming you'll ship the parts out. Then, a few weeks down the road you find out it's going to be difficult but you've already spent the money so you try to make it work whichever way you can. Then a few months down the road the buyer wants a refund but it's been 4 months since you received payment and not many people have $1000 (assuming that was close to the price including shipping) just laying around to give back to you.

That's all fine and dandy, but it's still the seller's responsibility to ensure that he takes into account the costs of shipping large items BEFORE he sells them, and to make sure the funds paid are available in case a refund situation occurs.

They should also establish any selling conditions (no refunds, no responsibility depending on the shipping method chosen by the buyer, etc...) with the buyer prior to taking their money.

I have no pity for sellers who can't manage their shit around items that are sold to other members, and thus no longer their property. If you've sold a part, you should treat it with respect and due diligence for your client.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
364 Posts
Discussion Starter #50
Just to add my $.02, shipping a bumper/body kit is a lot harder than most people think. I've shipped out quite a few and a single bumper or single pair of side skirts is fairly easy to ship within the US using greyhound. However, shipping overseas is an entirely different beast. Also, making a box to fit a bumper and side skirts is ridiculous.

I shipped out a full VS kit and between bubble wrap, adhesive, cardboard, tape etc. I spent well over $100. I also had a box that measured 84" x 40" x 40" constructed out of 30 smaller boxes. It took me roughly 10-12 hours to make over the course of 2 weeks. Then after all that, you have to find a way to transport it to whoever is shipping it (not many people have access to a vehicle that will carry this).

It's a very time consuming process and can be very overwhelming if you've never done it before. It seems that he didn't quite understand all the time and money needed to ship them to you and just wanted to refund you the money. Then you pushed a little and he decided to give in (which he shouldn't have b/c it just pushed him further into the hole) and we ended up here.

Another problem that you run into with this kind of transaction is that when it happens, people usually transfer the money to their bank account and it ends up getting spent assuming you'll ship the parts out. Then, a few weeks down the road you find out it's going to be difficult but you've already spent the money so you try to make it work whichever way you can. Then a few months down the road the buyer wants a refund but it's been 4 months since you received payment and not many people have $1000 (assuming that was close to the price including shipping) just laying around to give back to you.

I never payed him for shipping. I had a company ready for shipping i would have payed them. Al he needed to do was pack it so it was ready for shipping. He also didn't have to bring them anywhere because the shippingcompany would have come to the location he gave me for pick-up.

So that would not have been a problem

At the last point he didn't even had to make a box because he could wrap it in bubble wrap. I ask the shippingcompany if that was good and they sayed it was good enough for shipping
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
946 Posts
Ya, there's no real way to estimate how much bubble wrap, cardboard, glue, tape etc. you'll need to build a box for a bumper and side skirts unless you've already done it before. I wasn't trying to make excuses for him, just offering up a scenario that shows he just got in too deep and tried to right the ship but couldn't. Not that he just sold you the parts with no intention to ship them and just wanted to scam you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
354 Posts
Ya, there's no real way to estimate how much bubble wrap, cardboard, glue, tape etc. you'll need to build a box for a bumper and side skirts unless you've already done it before. I wasn't trying to make excuses for him, just offering up a scenario that shows he just got in too deep and tried to right the ship but couldn't. Not that he just sold you the parts with no intention to ship them and just wanted to scam you.
I've shipped a fiberglass bumper and materials only cost $30(cardboard included). It's not that hard to ship a bumper. It's finding the time to go leave it to a shipping office when you live far from any service carrier.

If the seller receives money that he/she placed the price on, they must fulfill their obligations to send that item. Their inability to send an item should never affect the buyer as they already had an agreed price.

Same goes to a buyer. A seller reserves the right to refuse the shipping of an item until the buyer has paid the agreed price in full.

From what I have read here, the buyer chose to pay extra for the repackaging of his item(something he wasn't supposed to do). In short, no excuses to not refund Johnny.
 

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
Ya, there's no real way to estimate how much bubble wrap, cardboard, glue, tape etc. you'll need to build a box for a bumper and side skirts unless you've already done it before.
Sorry to insist, but yes, any seller MUST evaluate these things before giving the interested buyer a shipping quote. Even if you under-evaluate the costs, it is still the seller's responsibility to either assume the extra costs/work, or re-negotiate the sale with the buyer, with the pending caveat that an immediate refund might be a necessity.

Failure to be able to handle shipping duties is no excuse when someone is trusting you with their money and new purchase.

Additionally, in this case, there's absolutely no excuse for Pave High if the buyer was handling all shipping arrangements from his side:

I never payed him for shipping. I had a company ready for shipping i would have payed them. Al he needed to do was pack it so it was ready for shipping. He also didn't have to bring them anywhere because the shippingcompany would have come to the location he gave me for pick-up.

So that would not have been a problem

At the last point he didn't even had to make a box because he could wrap it in bubble wrap. I ask the shippingcompany if that was good and they sayed it was good enough for shipping
 

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
Pave High, aka Keegan Bethke, has been officially added to the shady sellers list.
Don't buy anything from him, should he try to sell here later, or elsewhere.

Members of his Facebook Celica club: please take note at your own risk.
 

·
(..+
Joined
·
2,523 Posts
The money is pending.

For the record... This transaction is technically outside of disputable length. If i wanted to be a dick bag i could have just counter-disputed you in paypal and you would be boned. Instead i chose to accept without a counter. and have that money withdrawn regardless of having it at my disposal as Brandon mentioned. There are too many pertinents for me to post the full page but my here is a picture of my standing account balance. The dispute is shown as being "Reviewed by paypal" on my end. So... All I'm asking is you be patient.


The money is already gone out of my account. However long it takes to get to you. I don't know man.


I blame no one but myself in this transaction. I blame myself for giving into you instead of just refunding your money the instant i knew it wasn't going to happen. Instead as Brandon said, i caved and continued to try and make it work. This was an extremely complicated matter and i'm not gonna re-hash all the points I've already made about the mountains of evidence presented asking you to accept a refund a half dozen time over 5 months. I've had one other bad experience selling on this board (My tsunami wing) which again was instantly refunded despite the fact that i took a part back that the buyer in all likelihood broke. Outside of that i've got multiple sales without any issue like this. It was just a situation that went bad. I can say i whole heatedly apologize to you Johnny for all the trouble but you should probably own your own problems in this transaction instead of trying to make everything my fault. As far as being a "Shady Seller" or banned or anything like that. I really don't care at all. I know who i am and what I'm about and anyone here or in FCC or anywhere else can attest to that. I've already taken the liberty of removing myself as a FB admin and from the group. I don't need validation or for anyone here to tell me how "right" or "wrong" i am in this situation.

Not going to comment further.
 

·
Argentum Chaos Vae Victis
Joined
·
6,652 Posts
For the record... This transaction is technically outside of disputable length. If i wanted to be a dick bag i could have just counter-disputed you in paypal and you would be boned. Instead i chose to accept without a counter. and have that money withdrawn regardless of having it at my disposal as Brandon mentioned.

I blame no one but myself in this transaction. I blame myself for giving into you instead of just refunding your money the instant i knew it wasn't going to happen. Instead as Brandon said, i caved and continued to try and make it work. This was an extremely complicated matter and i'm not gonna re-hash all the points I've already made about the mountains of evidence presented asking you to accept a refund a half dozen time over 5 months. I've had one other bad experience selling on this board (My tsunami wing) which again was instantly refunded despite the fact that i took a part back that the buyer in all likelihood broke. Outside of that i've got multiple sales without any issue like this. It was just a situation that went bad. I can say i whole heatedly apologize to you Johnny for all the trouble but you should probably own your own problems in this transaction instead of trying to make everything my fault. As far as being a "Shady Seller" or banned or anything like that. I really don't care at all. I know who i am and what I'm about and anyone here or in FCC or anywhere else can attest to that. I've already taken the liberty of removing myself as a FB admin and from the group. I don't need validation or for anyone here to tell me how "right" or "wrong" i am in this situation.
The only reason we've reached this point is because you remained silent about the situation for the past few weeks, after telling me that you would take care of things.

Yes, it's unfortunate that you had to deal with a recalcitrant buyer, but as long as his money and parts remained in your hands, it was still your responsibility to see the transaction through, or refund the amount paid.
About being a dickbag and keeping (ie. stealing) the funds because of the time lapse status on the transaction, I seriously doubt PayPal would let you brazenly keep them with the amount of evidence shown by the buyer (and by the way, PayPal's buyer protection deadline has been increased to 6 months last year).

Regardless, you state that you deem yourself a respectable member of the Celica community, despite your indifference to your status here on these boards. Fine, if the funds are eventually confirmed as refunded, I'll remove your name from the shady list.

 
41 - 60 of 67 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top