[JakesFate]

I just notice something with the Rx300 subframe. It's rear chassis mounts could locate the celica upper control arms.
Rx300

Now celica lower contol arms are an easy swap with arm assy no.2 although none would be an exact fit, I just found this incredibly sexy.

That would leave two forward towers to be welded to chassis, (need 'em anyway) AND fab two rear platforms that don't exist on the Rx300 sub that in turn, would have been a direct bolt with matrix's rear subframe. Is this correct?

I️ don’t know about that. The rear subframe is the same as the altezza... it would probably be easier to weld a mount and brace to the current frame. The mount is a simple brace and rear bushings. Everything else is out of the way as far as I️ see it now. Using the rx300 subframe you would start cutting into the spare tire wheel well. Diff will replace muffler. Cat back? Will need new fuel tank or mod the current one. That I️ think would actually be the easier option

 

[2jz-style]

Is300/Altezza or same diff maybe? makes no sense, they have upper wishbone control arm and the diffs bolt directly into forward cross beam with no existing cradle.
MK4/GT4/IS300

I know R33 owners that swap the GTR subframe into a GTS-T for hp-boost application. I don't know about that, but there must be a higher reason..

 

[JakesFate]

Is300/Altezza or same diff maybe? makes no sense, they have upper wishbone control arm and the diffs bolt directly into forward cross beam with no existing cradle.
MK4/GT4/IS300

I know R33 owners that swap the GTR subframe into a GTS-T for hp-boost application. I don't know about that, but there must be a higher reason..

Let me correct myself, they don’t share a complete same rear. They do share a similar rear crossmember. So if like you state the bolts line up for the cross member it wouldn’t be that hard to weld the mounts you need on.

Rx300 cross member

 

[2jz-style]

I️ don’t know about that. The rear subframe is the same as the altezza... it would probably be easier to weld a mount and brace to the current frame. The mount is a simple brace and rear bushings. Everything else is out of the way as far as I️ see it now. Using the rx300 subframe you would start cutting into the spare tire wheel well. Diff will replace muffler. Cat back? Will need new fuel tank or mod the current one. That I️ think would actually be the easier option

Actually, I own a few specimens to base info from. If you want the most cost efficient way look at the OEM corolla exhaust.

It doesn't have independent rear suspension or subframe in the way of all you mention, minus the axle back cluster f**k issues..
Matrix Awd

Like the Ecm box & shift cables, it's all the preference of the installer, celica has axle back muffler where as corollas reserve that space for the independent rear setup if equipped with rear differential.

Also emission canister goes there, but I can't see anything since my GTS was 3.5" from the T3 turbo to custom magna flow tip with cat delete, I didn't really put that into thought.

Remove spare tire well, better access to rear diff for non street off road only.
Replace fuel cell with less capacity and flip the spare tire well to fire proof.. it won't be under the floor but it's not in the back seat either.

I can get the saddle tank around 180 cnd dollars and didn't really put that into thought either. But muffler and tank are different locations in corollas so try that.

 

[Boosted2.0]

Cool project. If you wind up needing to tune the auto trans and control the rear diff we can do that with a Hydra and a standalone trans controller.

 

[DatGTS00]

Glad to see that Dave is in on this

Was thinking the same thing about tuning this bad boy with a hydra. I'm really looking forward to seeing this happen with a u240e.

If successful, this would open the celica up to massive new potential. We could be challenging some SERIOUSLY expensive cars with the right setup.

 

[luizee1]

Any updates? Its been a month since the last one, and im dying to see this work!!

 

[DatGTS00]

Can't rush brilliance. I'm sure even if he not actively working on the project he's still putting some brain power towards it. I mean, how could you not? I'd be thinking about this non stop if it was my project

I'd love to know however if you ever did confirm 100% if the U140F diff parts truly do fit into a u240e. This would keep the cost down for me and one of the drivers of my car isn't actually allowed to drive manual (medical reasons)

Also everything seemed smooth(ish) sailing untill your attention shifted to mounting the rear up. Cutting into the spare tyre well is something I'm sure we'd all love avoiding if possible. But hey, if we're fabing up an exhaust, we can cut away some body

Appreciate your work here gents. I feel good about AWD happening this time around and it's good to see you're really pushing for that GT4esque functionality and not just settling. Quality is everything.

This could be big. Good luck

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[JakesFate]

Wow I didn't get notified of the latest replies, but thanks everyone for the support. To make a long story short I haven't been able to work on the car with work and the weather either its snowing (I dont have a garage to work in) or I am needed at work(Full time real estate agent) Now that that is out of the way I am taking this week off to get some of the project going again!!!

:blah: Anyways This will be a recap of day one!

I followed Smaays guide to get the transmission out you can find that here I dont have the right size socket to remove the axles from the hub so I just left them and took them off the struts and control arm... a lot easier than the other way I might add

At this point I was curious about the other axles which I already had from the lexus... so like anyone else would do I had to put them side by side and see the difference

Besides the bearing on the stock shaft they are the same length and appear to look like the same size... one just elongated.... to be sure I checked the driver side

Well I'll be damed they are almost exactly the same there is no way right? Could we really just get away with changing out the stub? To investigate even further I moved to the u140 which looking back is way too heavy to be lifting alone... I tore that thing apart as fast as I could. Only 17 bolts around the outside holding the bell housing on.

So there we have it the diff that has been talked about way too much in this thread... Seems kinda like a letdown after it being hyped up so much.. Well before any of you ask YES! I did immediately take the diff over to see if the celica axles would in fact mate with the diff...

They have the same teeth. the only difference is the way the other one is elongated... So while we have the car jacked up lets take a look underneath.

Looks pretty straight forward back... will need a different gas tank... and probably a new exhaust... I was thinking 2 or 2.5" I dont believe going higher than 2.5" would benefit... in fact I think it would decrease performance, but that's for another day!

Looking at the headers they may need to be modified, but other than that it looks like the transfer case just might fit there it isn't all that big. So after fighting with the transmission for another couple hours making sure that I would remember where all the bolts would go and smacking the h*ll out of my hand. I got the transmission out the c60 is extremely light I would say others say that it was heavy idk? I got it up on my workbench and can not find my gear pullers so Tomorrow I will be going to harbor freight and getting a new set... along with picking up my gear synchros. Will have another update tomorrow.

 

[JakesFate]

Recap of day two.... Here is where the fun begins...

I needed to replace my synchros so besides adding a new diff I needed to break down the c60 trans. I followed this guide here.

I recommend putting down something to catch the extra oil.... As I forgot, but I did remember gloves

Felt I should share this there is weird green paint all over my trans... idk why?

I didn't really document the breakdown of the c60 because there is alot of threads on that already. I spent all day doing that and once I got to the point that everyone was waiting for.... It finally hit me.

The differential is way too big... Which is expected I mean I pulled this off a highlander... But lets talk about this for a little. This is just to see if we can make it happen and I did say I would test everything. I didn't really spend all that much on the trans and I can resell it... I think? Does anyone need a u140 with 66k miles? After looking and staring at why was I that stupid. I noticed that there wasn't even a speed sensor ring on there... what the h*ll... I need to get some rest and get back to it in the morning... I will find a way to make this work... Sorry about the u140 problem, but gives us an idea of what we need to do

 

[JakesFate]

A word to describe day three? Stupid.





Alright so today I went back out to the bench and started piecing my trans back together by the way does anyone know why there is random green paint all over the inside of my trans

After that I took a moment at where I went wrong... Turns out a long time ago. So I did some further testing and comparing the transmissions... which confused me even more...

So the diff does work with the transmission. I didn't go wrong there, but the way I thought the diff worked isn't correct. First off excuse me for the bad video, but it is hard to do anything with one hand...



Watch the video here



but it confused me why when I add the intermediate shaft the other axle moves the opposite way... it was also very difficult to move it. At this point I took it out of the diff and put it in the transfer case and moved it. I then wondered if the axle that comes out of the diff is a separate shaft... it wasn't so now I was more confused. They both do the same thing... well that's not 100% true. The center lock is to have the car be awd full time. always sending power to the rear... so whats the need for the intermediate shaft that goes in between them? I dont know for sure. they dont go to separate places... so what would the need for it be. The center lock is active all the time as it is part of the final drive. They both go to the same place and I didn’t want to take apart the differential so I suspect inside with The viscous clutch the intermediate shaft is there to send power to the rear on demand/ on slippage which would explain the click and reverse turning there is probably a gear reduction in there making it a 50/50 split. I think there is still a way to salvage the parts I already purchased... mostly will involve that intermediate shaft I show in the second and third picture above. I kind of want to open up the transfer case and see whats going on there, but I am not too sure what kind of gear oil it takes. I should find out. not too much got done today I actually broke a couple clips on the last little bit of putting the trans back together... when I get a lsd I will not be happy to do this again.... theres actually a easier way to do it without removing 5/6 gears. Anyway till tomorrow thats today's update

 

[DatGTS00]

That's some good Guinea pigging

On the note of the paint inside the transmission, I think the reasons they do this are:

1: To prevent oil weeping inside the casting

2: To improve drainage

3: To prevent rust

4: Stick any remaining casting sand

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[2jz-style]

I think it's suppose to turn under the engine power by (final gear) is the case connected, what side is the axle on? those transaxles cannot be towed or dyno' by conventional way.

I'm working the block clearance design hard.. but rather than go back on a statement I will need to check for any wiggle room on a matrix 4wd, and if that was maxed out there's no point putting this up against the 2zz.

I'm looking up and down but can't see the two fitting even after a light sanding, the 2zz has a duel oil return baffle for some reason, extra oil holes that would otherwise miss the 1zz oil girdle.

Those four bosses (right) have no significance that I'm aware of so additional eyes are welcome.. after that is confirmed I will talk about the drain passages in the upper block.
[IMG]https://images.platforum.cloud/uploads/20180303/4ebb257d142e6d4a630fe1dfeea12a3c.jpg

Option: how long to replace the synchro?? need a ton of stuff to make your car auto??

 

[JakesFate]

The axle is on the passenger side. When I get all the pictures uploaded I will post a day 4 I took yesterday off... I think I can still make this work. I recently pulled parts off a matrix... The engine is further back and the transmission is actually a little different even on a 6speed. Any ideas on that? the diff is closer to the block and the intake is in a totally different spot. Synchro's took me about 5-7 hours... I dont have a press to I was doing it all by hand... long process... and very tiring hence the day off. I wont be making the car auto. Let me know if you want some transfer case dimensions... In fact later I will have a write up of me tearing it down.

This is from the bottom looking up but that ridge may need to be grind down a little where the exhaust mount is.

Let me know what you think of that plan or maybe there is a better way to do ths

 

[2jz-style]

Yes, but I don't know what ideas you referred to.. the 1zz engine isin't further back it's shape is entirely different upper and lower.

5 spd centre house is shape differently so in theory can't house a c60 transaxle, (haven't seen it) but the bell house is identical though.

Air box and battery are reversed, as is the cruise actuator reverses with the brake distributer and by far bigger better engine bay. That's why the intake angle varries (Matrix)

That ridge is part of the upper block too, but an All-trac was said to clear the upper ridge however extend deep into the lower half.

So it looks like the tables are reverse once again because your transfer case is much taller as it hits the 1zz upper ridge without the 4wd block?

Up side to this is the internal structures of both engines are based off the same cast. 2zz's are yamaha engineered, tuned very differently, I have a few ideas in mind.

 

[JakesFate]

Yes, but I don't know what ideas you referred to.. the 1zz engine isin't further back it's shape is entirely different upper and lower.

5 spd centre house is shape differently so in theory can't house a c60 transaxle, (haven't seen it) but the bell house is identical though.

Air box and battery are reversed, as is the cruise actuator reverses with the brake distributer and by far bigger better engine bay. That's why the intake angle varries (Matrix)

That ridge is part of the upper block too, but an All-trac was said to clear the upper ridge however extend deep into the lower half.

So it looks like the tables are reverse once again because your transfer case is much taller as it hits the 1zz upper ridge without the 4wd block?

Up side to this is the internal structures of both engines are based off the same cast. 2zz's are yamaha engineered, tuned very differently, I have a few ideas in mind.

I was talking about the 04 matrix xrs which has the 2zz it isnt awd I was just noticing the subtle differences in engine/trans.Dang it should fit with a little of clearance I just wanted to have that option in case of any problems. I dont know about the transfer case being too tall? the part number for the transfer case is 412-55571 I believe.

 

[JakesFate]

Day 4. Ooh boy today we take a look at the transfer case.

Just a note I wasn't able to completely finish today (more on that later) So up on the workbench today... as the transmission gaskets dry. is the transfer case

The subject on the dissection table. I was curious what the internals of this oh so important thing so today I wanted to take it apart and see if we cant re engineer something to work.

First thing I noticed was that one side was noticeably smaller than the other... also a bearing where the stock passenger shaft would also have a bearing. The shaft that sends power to the transfer case was too large to fit into the c60 diff. so we need to find a way to send power from the diff/ passenger shaft to the transfer case.

After taking the cap off all I could see is the roller bearing.:wtf2:

After getting the internal diff out I had to take off the part I mentioned earlier showing how the diff connects... Now that I see it all taken apart I dont know if it is all that needed.

The shaft will fit into one side but not the other. at this point I was thinking I could connect the passenger drive axle to the shaft to make it work. YAY, but then under further thinking I knew I would need a better option. one that I could easily take apart the axles and not take out the entire transmission every time.

I thought that if I just swapped the side the gear was on I could flip the diff making it work... yeah that wouldnt work the diff is definitely not asymmetric, but...

It was at this point that I was thinking if that one side will come off maybe the shaft on one side isn't actually a part of the diff... I dont have a good picture of it but it looks and feels like its just pressed in there... but whats the plan?

The shaft fits though on one side so if there is a way to get the axle all the way though. we could effectivly mark where the parts line up and weld the shaft to the axle making it connect to both the front axles and the rear sending 100% power to both. After I get a lsd then this option would be better, but this would still be a pretty cool awd almost like a 50% split then 100% on slip ? correct me if I am wrong. Only one problem here

The shaft doesn't fit over the stock celica axle. So I think I will either need the axle milled a little(I dont have a lathe) or I just trust the rx300 shaft and test it with the celica diff... It worked the other way around so it should work right? Anyway I wanted to call a couple of metal shops to get a small aluminum plate... which paused the project for today.

What do you think is this a bad idea? looking at the u140 diff all the axles are connected this also would help tremendously with the cost. as you could keep the stock axles.

 

[2jz-style]

Could you do a quick edit with some terminology that is familiar to figure #76
I must have missed a dozen steps like how does the *lock sleeve interact with the intermediate shaft(s) does the u140 diff push out onto the lock sleeve when slip occurs?

That would increase the rear torque amount and it's unclear if this was 100/0 normally (matrix) 50/50 slip.

All trac slip situation can be 0/100 but 50/50 normally.

I wonder if the c160 has what you need because I don't follow a word of this. How would you use the final drive? I could use the parts at a later time.

Great job getting the axles confirmed!

 

[JakesFate]

Could you do a quick edit with some terminology that is familiar to figure #76
I must have missed a dozen steps like how does the *lock sleeve interact with the intermediate shaft(s) does the u140 diff push out onto the lock sleeve when slip occurs?

That would increase the rear torque amount and it's unclear if this was 100/0 normally (matrix) 50/50 slip.

All trac slip situation can be 0/100 but 50/50 normally.

I wonder if the c160 has what you need because I don't follow a word of this. How would you use the final drive? I could use the parts at a later time.

Great job getting the axles confirmed!

I made a quick edit, there is a way to make it a straight 50/50 split. The only difference With the c160 is that it has a lsd making it able to transmit power to all wheels on slipping which is also what the viscous clutch pack does in the u140 final drive/ diff. My theory is to connect it to work alongside with the passenger axle. The u140 differential works very similar which makes me believe it will work, but the split really depends on that transfer case gear ratio


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[2jz-style]

So the elongated passenger shaft does not pass through the 4wd carrier bracket nor transfer case? Vs. the Highlander passenger shaft does not fit the celica hub?

Here's the pics from last weekend but JDM shops have some liabilities and I couldn't get any further at closer look.

He said they sold a JDM 2zz auto on a USDM 1zz 4wd traded in which is not very business sound unless it was for a friend doing the 2wd conversion.

If you throw some ideas out here I'll better know what to look for. I can't tell if the hubs are 4wd but disc is 275mm